Jamie Smith just made a hard-hitting post that truly made me think hard.  I have already been strongly considered about relocating to California to join my friends there if no job offer by May or early summer.   His post helped me realize that being local to few hours away is the key to breaking in.   Now my decision to relocate to that state is 95% certain but need to save a little more for the moving expenses to make it happen.  I can begin interning there.   Washington D.C. is certainly nice but I am only here to either get a job or use my internships at Smithsonian Institute as a "fast track" to a job anywhere but apparently, it is not working too well.  As I said earlier in one of my posts, I had two job interviews and both were, like Jaime Smith stressed,  local.  One with National Museum of Natural History and the other one with Gallaudet University.   Thank you, Jamie Smith. 

Ashley

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 10:58 AM, Wesley S. Creel <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Good Morning Ashley,
Back in the Bronze Age in 1972, I completed my post-graduate education in museum studies at the University of Leicester.  I returned to my hometown, New Orleans.  I could not find a museum job for two years.  Then in the summer of 1974, I was offered -- in the same week -- two jobs...... one job as a curator of anthropology at a university museum..... and, the other job,..... serving as a crew member, delivering a sailboat (ketch) from New Orleans to Tahiti.  I took the curator job and have been working in museums ever since.  The odyssey of finding that first museum job is a recurring story that has been with us for decades.
You may wish to check this list-serve's archives, since this subject has been discussed as long as I have been on this list-serve.
Best Wishes for Success,
Wesley
p.s. four decades later, I still wonder how my life would have changed, if I had taken the job of delivering yachts to distant ports.......
p.p.s.  RE: Job Search......The bottom line is PERSISTANCE.
During my 2 years of looking for that first full-time museum job, I remembered President Coolidge's thoughts on PERSISTANCE............
"Nothing in the world can take the place of Persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan 'Press On' has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race."
Wesley S. Creel
Administrator of Programs
Pink Palace Family of Museums
3050 Central Avenue
Memphis, TN 38111
www.memphismuseums.org
Office 901.636.2370  new telephone number
FAX 901.636.2391  new FAX number

Please consider including the Pink Palace Family of Museums in your charitable giving plans
along with your other charitable interests.
Please visit all our great facilities as well as our website: www.memphismuseums.org
Our mission: The Pink Palace Family of Museums inspires people to learn how history.science, technology and nature shape the mid-South. Through rich collections, thought-provoking exhibitions, and engaging programs, we encourage our diverse community to reflect on the past, understand the present, and influence the future

-----Original Message-----
From: Museum discussion list [mailto:To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1

========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 12:11:28 -0500 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Jillian Shoblock <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-9922746E-E215-4238-8914-F1821EA3B605 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> --Apple-Mail-9922746E-E215-4238-8914-F1821EA3B605 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ashley, I had one that was Skype but could have been done in person. Unfortunately it was the day after my niece was due so I chose the Skype option so I would not be out of town for my nieces birth. The other was a phone interview with 3 people on the other line. I have never experienced an e-mail interview, only follow-up questions or per-interview questions. Seems a bit strange to me. How do you get a feel for the person via email? Jillian Sent from my iPhone On Feb 21, 2013, at 11:27 AM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > One more thing but very important question to help everyone who are still struggling to find jobs like me so it need to be made as a separate post for more attention here. > > Anyone of you who already have job interviews, how was it conducted? In person, skype, email, or other means? > > For my two job interviews I had, the interview at Gallaudet University was in person while the National Museum of Natural History was done via email. Email-based interview was definitely a new experience for me. > > Ashley > > > On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:20 AM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote: >> Jamie Smith just made a hard-hitting post that truly made me think hard. I have already been strongly considered about relocating to California to join my friends there if no job offer by May or early summer. His post helped me realize that being local to few hours away is the key to breaking in. Now my decision to relocate to that state is 95% certain but need to save a little more for the moving expenses to make it happen. I can begin interning there. Washington D.C. is certainly nice but I am only here to either get a job or use my internships at Smithsonian Institute as a "fast track" to a job anywhere but apparently, it is not working too well. As I said earlier in one of my posts, I had two job interviews and both were, like Jaime Smith stressed, local. One with National Museum of Natural History and the other one with Gallaudet University. Thank you, Jamie Smith. >> >> Ashley >> >> >> On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 10:58 AM, Wesley S. Creel <[log in to unmask]> wrote: >>> Good Morning Ashley, >>> Back in the Bronze Age in 1972, I completed my post-graduate education in museum studies at the University of Leicester. I returned to my hometown, New Orleans. I could not find a museum job for two years. Then in the summer of 1974, I was offered -- in the same week -- two jobs...... one job as a curator of anthropology at a university museum..... and, the other job,..... serving as a crew member, delivering a sailboat (ketch) from New Orleans to Tahiti. I took the curator job and have been working in museums ever since. The odyssey of finding that first museum job is a recurring story that has been with us for decades. >>> You may wish to check this list-serve's archives, since this subject has been discussed as long as I have been on this list-serve. >>> Best Wishes for Success, >>> Wesley >>> p.s. four decades later, I still wonder how my life would have changed, if I had taken the job of delivering yachts to distant ports....... >>> p.p.s. RE: Job Search......The bottom line is PERSISTANCE. >>> During my 2 years of looking for that first full-time museum job, I remembered President Coolidge's thoughts on PERSISTANCE............ >>> "Nothing in the world can take the place of Persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan 'Press On' has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race." >>> Wesley S. Creel >>> Administrator of Programs >>> Pink Palace Family of Museums >>> 3050 Central Avenue >>> Memphis, TN 38111 >>> www.memphismuseums.org >>> Office 901.636.2370 new telephone number >>> FAX 901.636.2391 new FAX number >>> >>> Please consider including the Pink Palace Family of Museums in your charitable giving plans >>> along with your other charitable interests. >>> Please visit all our great facilities as well as our website: www.memphismuseums.org >>> Our mission: The Pink Palace Family of Museums inspires people to learn how history.science, technology and nature shape the mid-South. Through rich collections, thought-provoking exhibitions, and engaging programs, we encourage our diverse community to reflect on the past, understand the present, and influence the future >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Museum discussion list [mailto:To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >>> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). --Apple-Mail-9922746E-E215-4238-8914-F1821EA3B605 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Ashley,

I had one that was Skype but could have been done in person. Unfortunately it was the day after my niece was due so I chose the Skype option so I would not be out of town for my nieces birth. The other was a phone interview with 3 people on the other line. I have never experienced an e-mail interview, only follow-up questions or per-interview questions. Seems a bit strange to me. How do you get a feel for the person via email?

Jillian

Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 21, 2013, at 11:27 AM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

One more thing but very important question to help everyone who are still struggling to find jobs like me so it need to be made as a separate post for more attention here. 

Anyone of you who already have job interviews,  how was it conducted? In person, skype, email, or other means?  

For my two job interviews I had, the interview at Gallaudet University was in person while the National Museum of Natural History was done via email.  Email-based interview was definitely a new experience for me.    

Ashley

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:20 AM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Jamie Smith just made a hard-hitting post that truly made me think hard.  I have already been strongly considered about relocating to California to join my friends there if no job offer by May or early summer.   His post helped me realize that being local to few hours away is the key to breaking in.   Now my decision to relocate to that state is 95% certain but need to save a little more for the moving expenses to make it happen.  I can begin interning there.   Washington D.C. is certainly nice but I am only here to either get a job or use my internships at Smithsonian Institute as a "fast track" to a job anywhere but apparently, it is not working too well.  As I said earlier in one of my posts, I had two job interviews and both were, like Jaime Smith stressed,  local.  One with National Museum of Natural History and the other one with Gallaudet University.   Thank you, Jamie Smith. 

Ashley

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 10:58 AM, Wesley S. Creel <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Good Morning Ashley,
Back in the Bronze Age in 1972, I completed my post-graduate education in museum studies at the University of Leicester.  I returned to my hometown, New Orleans.  I could not find a museum job for two years.  Then in the summer of 1974, I was offered -- in the same week -- two jobs...... one job as a curator of anthropology at a university museum..... and, the other job,..... serving as a crew member, delivering a sailboat (ketch) from New Orleans to Tahiti.  I took the curator job and have been working in museums ever since.  The odyssey of finding that first museum job is a recurring story that has been with us for decades.
You may wish to check this list-serve's archives, since this subject has been discussed as long as I have been on this list-serve.
Best Wishes for Success,
Wesley
p.s. four decades later, I still wonder how my life would have changed, if I had taken the job of delivering yachts to distant ports.......
p.p.s.  RE: Job Search......The bottom line is PERSISTANCE.
During my 2 years of looking for that first full-time museum job, I remembered President Coolidge's thoughts on PERSISTANCE............
"Nothing in the world can take the place of Persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan 'Press On' has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race."
Wesley S. Creel
Administrator of Programs
Pink Palace Family of Museums
3050 Central Avenue
Memphis, TN 38111
www.memphismuseums.org
Office 901.636.2370  new telephone number
FAX 901.636.2391  new FAX number

Please consider including the Pink Palace Family of Museums in your charitable giving plans
along with your other charitable interests.
Please visit all our great facilities as well as our website: www.memphismuseums.org
Our mission: The Pink Palace Family of Museums inspires people to learn how history.science, technology and nature shape the mid-South. Through rich collections, thought-provoking exhibitions, and engaging programs, we encourage our diverse community to reflect on the past, understand the present, and influence the future

-----Original Message-----
From: Museum discussion list [mailto:To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1

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--Apple-Mail-9922746E-E215-4238-8914-F1821EA3B605-- ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 12:20:17 -0500 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Marc A Williams <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00EE_01CE102D.CF1AB5D0" Message-ID: <9C75FAB6ACF04550BC8975D35A6D579A@PC261231188215> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00EE_01CE102D.CF1AB5D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ashley, I have had two museum interviews relatively recently, one by phone and one in person. The in-person one was in an adjoining state about 2 hours away. Expenses were not paid. I believe this is fairly common. If you are head-hunted (asked by the prospective employer or their search firm to apply), expenses usually are paid. However, head hunting usually only occurs for experienced employees. Unless a recent graduate is unusually exceptional in some way, this avenue is not open to them. Personally, I did not like the phone interview. For one thing, I did not get to see the facilities. After all, hiring is a two-way street - they have to want me and I have to want them. For another, I did not get to dazzle them with my charm, interpersonal skills, and aura. ;) The other thing to remember about interviews is that some organizations do them in two or more tiers. The first level may be by phone or email or even Skype. After the first cut, subsequent interviews may be in person. You also asked a question about mentioning you would be willing to pay relocation expenses in your cover letter. Personally, I would find this a bit premature and perhaps appearing too desperate, which may subliminally make the employer wonder why. If they contact you back and begin a discussion, that's when it may be appropriate to discuss money. However, the general rule is not to discuss money until the job is being offered, since it is a package deal - salary, moving expenses, benefits, vacation, attendance at conferences, etc. Each individual will see this differently, though, so it will depend upon how the specific person receiving your application responds. I believe that a statement in your cover letter to the effect that you are fully prepared to relocate for the job (without mentioning money) will serve you as well without raising any negative issues. Marc American Conservation Consortium, Ltd. 4 Rockville Road Broad Brook, CT 06016 www.conservator.com 860-386-6058 Marc A. Williams, President MS in Art Conservation, Winterthur Museum Program Former Chief Wooden Objects Conservator, Smithsonian Institution Fellow, American Institute for Conservation (AIC) ----- Original Message ----- From: Ashley Watson To: [log in to unmask] Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 11:27 AM Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates One more thing but very important question to help everyone who are still struggling to find jobs like me so it need to be made as a separate post for more attention here. Anyone of you who already have job interviews, how was it conducted? In person, skype, email, or other means? For my two job interviews I had, the interview at Gallaudet University was in person while the National Museum of Natural History was done via email. Email-based interview was definitely a new experience for me. Ashley On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:20 AM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote: Jamie Smith just made a hard-hitting post that truly made me think hard. I have already been strongly considered about relocating to California to join my friends there if no job offer by May or early summer. His post helped me realize that being local to few hours away is the key to breaking in. Now my decision to relocate to that state is 95% certain but need to save a little more for the moving expenses to make it happen. I can begin interning there. Washington D.C. is certainly nice but I am only here to either get a job or use my internships at Smithsonian Institute as a "fast track" to a job anywhere but apparently, it is not working too well. As I said earlier in one of my posts, I had two job interviews and both were, like Jaime Smith stressed, local. One with National Museum of Natural History and the other one with Gallaudet University. Thank you, Jamie Smith. Ashley On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 10:58 AM, Wesley S. Creel <[log in to unmask]> wrote: Good Morning Ashley, Back in the Bronze Age in 1972, I completed my post-graduate education in museum studies at the University of Leicester. I returned to my hometown, New Orleans. I could not find a museum job for two years. Then in the summer of 1974, I was offered -- in the same week -- two jobs...... one job as a curator of anthropology at a university museum..... and, the other job,..... serving as a crew member, delivering a sailboat (ketch) from New Orleans to Tahiti. I took the curator job and have been working in museums ever since. The odyssey of finding that first museum job is a recurring story that has been with us for decades. You may wish to check this list-serve's archives, since this subject has been discussed as long as I have been on this list-serve. Best Wishes for Success, Wesley p.s. four decades later, I still wonder how my life would have changed, if I had taken the job of delivering yachts to distant ports....... p.p.s. RE: Job Search......The bottom line is PERSISTANCE. During my 2 years of looking for that first full-time museum job, I remembered President Coolidge's thoughts on PERSISTANCE............ "Nothing in the world can take the place of Persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan 'Press On' has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race." Wesley S. Creel Administrator of Programs Pink Palace Family of Museums 3050 Central Avenue Memphis, TN 38111 www.memphismuseums.org Office 901.636.2370 new telephone number FAX 901.636.2391 new FAX number Please consider including the Pink Palace Family of Museums in your charitable giving plans along with your other charitable interests. Please visit all our great facilities as well as our website: www.memphismuseums.org Our mission: The Pink Palace Family of Museums inspires people to learn how history.science, technology and nature shape the mid-South. Through rich collections, thought-provoking exhibitions, and engaging programs, we encourage our diverse community to reflect on the past, understand the present, and influence the future -----Original Message----- From: Museum discussion list [mailto:To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ------=_NextPart_000_00EE_01CE102D.CF1AB5D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Ashley,

 

I have had two museum interviews relatively recently, one by phone and one in person.  The in-person one was in an adjoining state about 2 hours away.  Expenses were not paid.  I believe this is fairly common.  If you are head-hunted (asked by the prospective employer or their search firm to apply), expenses usually are paid.  However, head hunting usually only occurs for experienced employees.  Unless a recent graduate is unusually exceptional in some way, this avenue is not open to them.

 

Personally, I did not like the phone interview.  For one thing, I did not get to see the facilities.  After all, hiring is a two-way street - they have to want me and I have to want them.  For another, I did not get to dazzle them with my charm, interpersonal skills, and aura. ;)  The other thing to remember about interviews is that some organizations do them in two or more tiers.  The first level may be by phone or email or even Skype.  After the first cut, subsequent interviews may be in person.

 

You also asked a question about mentioning you would be willing to pay relocation expenses in your cover letter.  Personally, I would find this a bit premature and perhaps appearing too desperate, which may subliminally make the employer wonder why.  If they contact you back and begin a discussion, that's when it may be appropriate to discuss money.  However, the general rule is not to discuss money until the job is being offered, since it is a package deal - salary, moving expenses, benefits, vacation, attendance at conferences, etc.  Each individual will see this differently, though, so it will depend upon how the specific person receiving your application responds.  I believe that a statement in your cover letter to the effect that you are fully prepared to relocate for the job (without mentioning money) will serve you as well without raising any negative issues.

 

Marc

American Conservation Consortium, Ltd.
     4 Rockville Road
     Broad Brook, CT 06016
     www.conservator.com
     860-386-6058

 

Marc A. Williams, President
     MS in Art Conservation, Winterthur Museum Program
     Former Chief Wooden Objects Conservator, Smithsonian Institution
     Fellow, American Institute for Conservation (AIC)

 

 

----- Original Message -----

From: [log in to unmask] href="mailto:[log in to unmask]">Ashley Watson

To: [log in to unmask] href="mailto:[log in to unmask]">[log in to unmask]

Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 11:27 AM

Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

One more thing but very important question to help everyone who are still struggling to find jobs like me so it need to be made as a separate post for more attention here. 

Anyone of you who already have job interviews,  how was it conducted? In person, skype, email, or other means?  

For my two job interviews I had, the interview at Gallaudet University was in person while the National Museum of Natural History was done via email.  Email-based interview was definitely a new experience for me.    

Ashley

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:20 AM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Jamie Smith just made a hard-hitting post that truly made me think hard.  I have already been strongly considered about relocating to California to join my friends there if no job offer by May or early summer.   His post helped me realize that being local to few hours away is the key to breaking in.   Now my decision to relocate to that state is 95% certain but need to save a little more for the moving expenses to make it happen.  I can begin interning there.   Washington D.C. is certainly nice but I am only here to either get a job or use my internships at Smithsonian Institute as a "fast track" to a job anywhere but apparently, it is not working too well.  As I said earlier in one of my posts, I had two job interviews and both were, like Jaime Smith stressed,  local.  One with National Museum of Natural History and the other one with Gallaudet University.   Thank you, Jamie Smith. 

Ashley

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 10:58 AM, Wesley S. Creel <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Good Morning Ashley,
Back in the Bronze Age in 1972, I completed my post-graduate education in museum studies at the University of Leicester.  I returned to my hometown, New Orleans.  I could not find a museum job for two years.  Then in the summer of 1974, I was offered -- in the same week -- two jobs...... one job as a curator of anthropology at a university museum..... and, the other job,..... serving as a crew member, delivering a sailboat (ketch) from New Orleans to Tahiti.  I took the curator job and have been working in museums ever since.  The odyssey of finding that first museum job is a recurring story that has been with us for decades.
You may wish to check this list-serve's archives, since this subject has been discussed as long as I have been on this list-serve.
Best Wishes for Success,
Wesley
p.s. four decades later, I still wonder how my life would have changed, if I had taken the job of delivering yachts to distant ports.......
p.p.s.  RE: Job Search......The bottom line is PERSISTANCE.
During my 2 years of looking for that first full-time museum job, I remembered President Coolidge's thoughts on PERSISTANCE............
"Nothing in the world can take the place of Persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan 'Press On' has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race."
Wesley S. Creel
Administrator of Programs
Pink Palace Family of Museums
3050 Central Avenue
Memphis, TN 38111
www.memphismuseums.org
Office 901.636.2370  new telephone number
FAX 901.636.2391  new FAX number

Please consider including the Pink Palace Family of Museums in your charitable giving plans
along with your other charitable interests.
Please visit all our great facilities as well as our website: www.memphismuseums.org
Our mission: The Pink Palace Family of Museums inspires people to learn how history.science, technology and nature shape the mid-South. Through rich collections, thought-provoking exhibitions, and engaging programs, we encourage our diverse community to reflect on the past, understand the present, and influence the future

-----Original Message-----
From: Museum discussion list [mailto:To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1

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------=_NextPart_000_00EE_01CE102D.CF1AB5D0-- ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 04:02:21 -0600 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Kathleen O'Connor <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Faux Foods MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundaryMessage-ID: <[log in to unmask]> --0015175d02debb77ee04d6392bf0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Henri Gadbois, at www.fauxfoods.com, has a variety of prepared faux foods, and has also done custom orders for many museums. He does wonderful work. Kathleen O'Connor ========================================================Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). --0015175d02debb77ee04d6392bf0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Henri Gadbois, at www.fauxfoods.com,  has a variety of prepared faux foods, and has also done custom orders for many museums.  He does wonderful work.

Kathleen O'Connor

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--0015175d02debb77ee04d6392bf0-- ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 11:32:36 -0600 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Shana West <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates In-Reply-To: <9C75FAB6ACF04550BC8975D35A6D579A@PC261231188215> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundaryè9a8f647b41ec810704d63f758e Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> --e89a8f647b41ec810704d63f758e Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 I agree with Marc, Ashley. I was suggesting to say in the cover letter that you are already planning to move to that city for other reasons. Something like, "I have been planning a move to X this spring to be near friends and family/because my partner has a job there/because I have always wanted to make my home there (whatever the reason), and was excited to see this job posting...." That way, you're hinting you'll cover the moving expenses without saying so outright and appearing presumptive. Especially if it's a place you want to be, then it wouldn't be too far from the truth! Cheers, Shana On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:20 AM, Marc A Williams <[log in to unmask]>wrote: > ** > Ashley, > > I have had two museum interviews relatively recently, one by phone and one > in person. The in-person one was in an adjoining state about 2 hours > away. Expenses were not paid. I believe this is fairly common. If you > are head-hunted (asked by the prospective employer or their search firm to > apply), expenses usually are paid. However, head hunting usually only > occurs for experienced employees. Unless a recent graduate is unusually > exceptional in some way, this avenue is not open to them. > > Personally, I did not like the phone interview. For one thing, I did not > get to see the facilities. After all, hiring is a two-way street - they > have to want me and I have to want them. For another, I did not get to > dazzle them with my charm, interpersonal skills, and aura. ;) The other > thing to remember about interviews is that some organizations do them in > two or more tiers. The first level may be by phone or email or even > Skype. After the first cut, subsequent interviews may be in person. > > You also asked a question about mentioning you would be willing to pay > relocation expenses in your cover letter. Personally, I would find this a > bit premature and perhaps appearing too desperate, which may subliminally > make the employer wonder why. If they contact you back and begin a > discussion, that's when it may be appropriate to discuss money. However, > the general rule is not to discuss money until the job is being offered, > since it is a package deal - salary, moving expenses, benefits, vacation, > attendance at conferences, etc. Each individual will see this differently, > though, so it will depend upon how the specific person receiving your > application responds. I believe that a statement in your cover letter to > the effect that you are fully prepared to relocate for the job (without > mentioning money) will serve you as well without raising any negative > issues. > > Marc > > American Conservation Consortium, Ltd. > 4 Rockville Road > Broad Brook, CT 06016 > www.conservator.com > 860-386-6058 > > Marc A. Williams, President > MS in Art Conservation, Winterthur Museum Program > Former Chief Wooden Objects Conservator, Smithsonian Institution > Fellow, American Institute for Conservation (AIC) > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> > *To:* [log in to unmask] > *Sent:* Thursday, February 21, 2013 11:27 AM > *Subject:* Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent > graduates > > One more thing but very important question to help everyone who are still > struggling to find jobs like me so it need to be made as a separate post > for more attention here. > > Anyone of you who already have job interviews, how was it conducted? In > person, skype, email, or other means? > > For my two job interviews I had, the interview at Gallaudet University was > in person while the National Museum of Natural History was done via email. > Email-based interview was definitely a new experience for me. > > Ashley > > > On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:20 AM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > >> Jamie Smith just made a hard-hitting post that truly made me think hard. >> I have already been strongly considered about relocating to California to >> join my friends there if no job offer by May or early summer. His post >> helped me realize that being local to few hours away is the key to breaking >> in. Now my decision to relocate to that state is 95% certain but need to >> save a little more for the moving expenses to make it happen. I can begin >> interning there. Washington D.C. is certainly nice but I am only here to >> either get a job or use my internships at Smithsonian Institute as a "fast >> track" to a job anywhere but apparently, it is not working too well. As I >> said earlier in one of my posts, I had two job interviews and both were, >> like Jaime Smith stressed, local. One with National Museum of Natural >> History and the other one with Gallaudet University. Thank you, Jamie >> Smith. >> >> Ashley >> >> >> On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 10:58 AM, Wesley S. Creel < >> [log in to unmask]> wrote: >> >>> Good Morning Ashley, >>> Back in the Bronze Age in 1972, I completed my post-graduate education >>> in museum studies at the University of Leicester. I returned to my >>> hometown, New Orleans. I could not find a museum job for two years. Then >>> in the summer of 1974, I was offered -- in the same week -- two jobs...... >>> one job as a curator of anthropology at a university museum..... and, the >>> other job,..... serving as a crew member, delivering a sailboat (ketch) >>> from New Orleans to Tahiti. I took the curator job and have been working >>> in museums ever since. The odyssey of finding that first museum job is a >>> recurring story that has been with us for decades. >>> You may wish to check this list-serve's archives, since this subject has >>> been discussed as long as I have been on this list-serve. >>> Best Wishes for Success, >>> Wesley >>> p.s. four decades later, I still wonder how my life would have changed, >>> if I had taken the job of delivering yachts to distant ports....... >>> p.p.s. RE: Job Search......The bottom line is PERSISTANCE. >>> During my 2 years of looking for that first full-time museum job, I >>> remembered President Coolidge's thoughts on PERSISTANCE............ >>> "Nothing in the world can take the place of Persistence. Talent will >>> not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will >>> not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world >>> is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are >>> omnipotent. The slogan 'Press On' has solved and always will solve the >>> problems of the human race." >>> Wesley S. Creel >>> Administrator of Programs >>> Pink Palace Family of Museums >>> 3050 Central Avenue >>> Memphis, TN 38111 >>> www.memphismuseums.org >>> Office 901.636.2370 new telephone number >>> FAX 901.636.2391 new FAX number >>> >>> Please consider including the Pink Palace Family of Museums in your >>> charitable giving plans >>> along with your other charitable interests. >>> Please visit all our great facilities as well as our website: >>> www.memphismuseums.org >>> Our mission: The Pink Palace Family of Museums inspires people to learn >>> how history.science, technology and nature shape the mid-South. Through >>> rich collections, thought-provoking exhibitions, and engaging programs, we >>> encourage our diverse community to reflect on the past, understand the >>> present, and influence the future >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Museum discussion list [mailto:To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L >>> list, click the following link: >>> <[log in to unmask]> >>> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 >>> >>> > ------------------------------ > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 > ========================================================Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). --e89a8f647b41ec810704d63f758e Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I agree with Marc, Ashley. I was suggesting to say in the cover letter that you are already planning to move to that city for other reasons. Something like, "I have been planning a move to X this spring to be near friends and family/because my partner has a job there/because I have always wanted to make my home there (whatever the reason), and was excited to see this job posting...." That way, you're hinting you'll cover the moving expenses without saying so outright and appearing presumptive.

Especially if it's a place you want to be, then it wouldn't be too far from the truth!

Cheers,

Shana

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:20 AM, Marc A Williams <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Ashley,

 

I have had two museum interviews relatively recently, one by phone and one in person.  The in-person one was in an adjoining state about 2 hours away.  Expenses were not paid.  I believe this is fairly common.  If you are head-hunted (asked by the prospective employer or their search firm to apply), expenses usually are paid.  However, head hunting usually only occurs for experienced employees.  Unless a recent graduate is unusually exceptional in some way, this avenue is not open to them.

 

Personally, I did not like the phone interview.  For one thing, I did not get to see the facilities.  After all, hiring is a two-way street - they have to want me and I have to want them.  For another, I did not get to dazzle them with my charm, interpersonal skills, and aura. ;)  The other thing to remember about interviews is that some organizations do them in two or more tiers.  The first level may be by phone or email or even Skype.  After the first cut, subsequent interviews may be in person.

 

You also asked a question about mentioning you would be willing to pay relocation expenses in your cover letter.  Personally, I would find this a bit premature and perhaps appearing too desperate, which may subliminally make the employer wonder why.  If they contact you back and begin a discussion, that's when it may be appropriate to discuss money.  However, the general rule is not to discuss money until the job is being offered, since it is a package deal - salary, moving expenses, benefits, vacation, attendance at conferences, etc.  Each individual will see this differently, though, so it will depend upon how the specific person receiving your application responds.  I believe that a statement in your cover letter to the effect that you are fully prepared to relocate for the job (without mentioning money) will serve you as well without raising any negative issues.

 

Marc

American Conservation Consortium, Ltd.
     4 Rockville Road
     Broad Brook, CT 06016
     www.conservator.com
     860-386-6058

 

Marc A. Williams, President
     MS in Art Conservation, Winterthur Museum Program
     Former Chief Wooden Objects Conservator, Smithsonian Institution
     Fellow, American Institute for Conservation (AIC)

 

 

----- Original Message -----

From: [log in to unmask]" href="mailto:[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">Ashley Watson

To: [log in to unmask]" href="mailto:[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">[log in to unmask]

Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 11:27 AM

Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

One more thing but very important question to help everyone who are still struggling to find jobs like me so it need to be made as a separate post for more attention here. 

Anyone of you who already have job interviews,  how was it conducted? In person, skype, email, or other means?  

For my two job interviews I had, the interview at Gallaudet University was in person while the National Museum of Natural History was done via email.  Email-based interview was definitely a new experience for me.    

Ashley

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:20 AM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Jamie Smith just made a hard-hitting post that truly made me think hard.  I have already been strongly considered about relocating to California to join my friends there if no job offer by May or early summer.   His post helped me realize that being local to few hours away is the key to breaking in.   Now my decision to relocate to that state is 95% certain but need to save a little more for the moving expenses to make it happen.  I can begin interning there.   Washington D.C. is certainly nice but I am only here to either get a job or use my internships at Smithsonian Institute as a "fast track" to a job anywhere but apparently, it is not working too well.  As I said earlier in one of my posts, I had two job interviews and both were, like Jaime Smith stressed,  local.  One with National Museum of Natural History and the other one with Gallaudet University.   Thank you, Jamie Smith. 

Ashley

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 10:58 AM, Wesley S. Creel <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Good Morning Ashley,
Back in the Bronze Age in 1972, I completed my post-graduate education in museum studies at the University of Leicester.  I returned to my hometown, New Orleans.  I could not find a museum job for two years.  Then in the summer of 1974, I was offered -- in the same week -- two jobs...... one job as a curator of anthropology at a university museum..... and, the other job,..... serving as a crew member, delivering a sailboat (ketch) from New Orleans to Tahiti.  I took the curator job and have been working in museums ever since.  The odyssey of finding that first museum job is a recurring story that has been with us for decades.
You may wish to check this list-serve's archives, since this subject has been discussed as long as I have been on this list-serve.
Best Wishes for Success,
Wesley
p.s. four decades later, I still wonder how my life would have changed, if I had taken the job of delivering yachts to distant ports.......
p.p.s.  RE: Job Search......The bottom line is PERSISTANCE.
During my 2 years of looking for that first full-time museum job, I remembered President Coolidge's thoughts on PERSISTANCE............
"Nothing in the world can take the place of Persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan 'Press On' has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race."
Wesley S. Creel
Administrator of Programs
Pink Palace Family of Museums
3050 Central Avenue
Memphis, TN 38111
www.memphismuseums.org
Office 901.636.2370  new telephone number
FAX 901.636.2391  new FAX number

Please consider including the Pink Palace Family of Museums in your charitable giving plans
along with your other charitable interests.
Please visit all our great facilities as well as our website: www.memphismuseums.org
Our mission: The Pink Palace Family of Museums inspires people to learn how history.science, technology and nature shape the mid-South. Through rich collections, thought-provoking exhibitions, and engaging programs, we encourage our diverse community to reflect on the past, understand the present, and influence the future

-----Original Message-----
From: Museum discussion list [mailto:To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link:
http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1

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--e89a8f647b41ec810704d63f758e-- ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 12:55:49 -0500 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary¼aec54b4aa2fa57e904d63fc8e1 Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> --bcaec54b4aa2fa57e904d63fc8e1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 First of all, I have to concur with Marc and Shana. Keep the monetary information out till being contacted for the job interview. Jillian and Marc, thanks for your input about your interview experiences. Yes, having an email-based interview with all those questions for me to answer was a surreal experience because I can't personally charm them off the floor like Marc stated. I did have a video phone interview in 2008 for a non museum job and it was not sufficiently productive on both ends. As I have stated earlier, it is a bit of challenge from the other side's perspective as I am Deaf. I do not see it as anything negative as I am very confident in my capabilities. Ashley On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:32 PM, Shana West <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > I agree with Marc, Ashley. I was suggesting to say in the cover letter > that you are already planning to move to that city for other reasons. > Something like, "I have been planning a move to X this spring to be near > friends and family/because my partner has a job there/because I have always > wanted to make my home there (whatever the reason), and was excited to see > this job posting...." That way, you're hinting you'll cover the moving > expenses without saying so outright and appearing presumptive. > Especially if it's a place you want to be, then it wouldn't be too far > from the truth! > > Cheers, > Shana > > > On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:20 AM, Marc A Williams <[log in to unmask] > > wrote: > >> ** >> Ashley, >> >> I have had two museum interviews relatively recently, one by phone and >> one in person. The in-person one was in an adjoining state about 2 hours >> away. Expenses were not paid. I believe this is fairly common. If you >> are head-hunted (asked by the prospective employer or their search firm to >> apply), expenses usually are paid. However, head hunting usually only >> occurs for experienced employees. Unless a recent graduate is unusually >> exceptional in some way, this avenue is not open to them. >> >> Personally, I did not like the phone interview. For one thing, I did not >> get to see the facilities. After all, hiring is a two-way street - they >> have to want me and I have to want them. For another, I did not get to >> dazzle them with my charm, interpersonal skills, and aura. ;) The other >> thing to remember about interviews is that some organizations do them in >> two or more tiers. The first level may be by phone or email or even >> Skype. After the first cut, subsequent interviews may be in person. >> >> You also asked a question about mentioning you would be willing to pay >> relocation expenses in your cover letter. Personally, I would find this a >> bit premature and perhaps appearing too desperate, which may subliminally >> make the employer wonder why. If they contact you back and begin a >> discussion, that's when it may be appropriate to discuss money. However, >> the general rule is not to discuss money until the job is being offered, >> since it is a package deal - salary, moving expenses, benefits, vacation, >> attendance at conferences, etc. Each individual will see this differently, >> though, so it will depend upon how the specific person receiving your >> application responds. I believe that a statement in your cover letter to >> the effect that you are fully prepared to relocate for the job (without >> mentioning money) will serve you as well without raising any negative >> issues. >> >> Marc >> >> American Conservation Consortium, Ltd. >> 4 Rockville Road >> Broad Brook, CT 06016 >> www.conservator.com >> 860-386-6058 >> >> Marc A. Williams, President >> MS in Art Conservation, Winterthur Museum Program >> Former Chief Wooden Objects Conservator, Smithsonian Institution >> Fellow, American Institute for Conservation (AIC) >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> *From:* Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> >> *To:* [log in to unmask] >> *Sent:* Thursday, February 21, 2013 11:27 AM >> *Subject:* Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent >> graduates >> >> One more thing but very important question to help everyone who are still >> struggling to find jobs like me so it need to be made as a separate post >> for more attention here. >> >> Anyone of you who already have job interviews, how was it conducted? In >> person, skype, email, or other means? >> >> For my two job interviews I had, the interview at Gallaudet University >> was in person while the National Museum of Natural History was done via >> email. Email-based interview was definitely a new experience for me. >> >> Ashley >> >> >> On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:20 AM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote: >> >>> Jamie Smith just made a hard-hitting post that truly made me think hard. >>> I have already been strongly considered about relocating to California to >>> join my friends there if no job offer by May or early summer. His post >>> helped me realize that being local to few hours away is the key to breaking >>> in. Now my decision to relocate to that state is 95% certain but need to >>> save a little more for the moving expenses to make it happen. I can begin >>> interning there. Washington D.C. is certainly nice but I am only here to >>> either get a job or use my internships at Smithsonian Institute as a "fast >>> track" to a job anywhere but apparently, it is not working too well. As I >>> said earlier in one of my posts, I had two job interviews and both were, >>> like Jaime Smith stressed, local. One with National Museum of Natural >>> History and the other one with Gallaudet University. Thank you, Jamie >>> Smith. >>> >>> Ashley >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 10:58 AM, Wesley S. Creel < >>> [log in to unmask]> wrote: >>> >>>> Good Morning Ashley, >>>> Back in the Bronze Age in 1972, I completed my post-graduate education >>>> in museum studies at the University of Leicester. I returned to my >>>> hometown, New Orleans. I could not find a museum job for two years. Then >>>> in the summer of 1974, I was offered -- in the same week -- two jobs...... >>>> one job as a curator of anthropology at a university museum..... and, the >>>> other job,..... serving as a crew member, delivering a sailboat (ketch) >>>> from New Orleans to Tahiti. I took the curator job and have been working >>>> in museums ever since. The odyssey of finding that first museum job is a >>>> recurring story that has been with us for decades. >>>> You may wish to check this list-serve's archives, since this subject >>>> has been discussed as long as I have been on this list-serve. >>>> Best Wishes for Success, >>>> Wesley >>>> p.s. four decades later, I still wonder how my life would have changed, >>>> if I had taken the job of delivering yachts to distant ports....... >>>> p.p.s. RE: Job Search......The bottom line is PERSISTANCE. >>>> During my 2 years of looking for that first full-time museum job, I >>>> remembered President Coolidge's thoughts on PERSISTANCE............ >>>> "Nothing in the world can take the place of Persistence. Talent will >>>> not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will >>>> not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world >>>> is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are >>>> omnipotent. The slogan 'Press On' has solved and always will solve the >>>> problems of the human race." >>>> Wesley S. Creel >>>> Administrator of Programs >>>> Pink Palace Family of Museums >>>> 3050 Central Avenue >>>> Memphis, TN 38111 >>>> www.memphismuseums.org >>>> Office 901.636.2370 new telephone number >>>> FAX 901.636.2391 new FAX number >>>> >>>> Please consider including the Pink Palace Family of Museums in your >>>> charitable giving plans >>>> along with your other charitable interests. >>>> Please visit all our great facilities as well as our website: >>>> www.memphismuseums.org >>>> Our mission: The Pink Palace Family of Museums inspires people to learn >>>> how history.science, technology and nature shape the mid-South. Through >>>> rich collections, thought-provoking exhibitions, and engaging programs, we >>>> encourage our diverse community to reflect on the past, understand the >>>> present, and influence the future >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: Museum discussion list [mailto:To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L >>>> list, click the following link: >>>> <[log in to unmask]> >>>> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 >>>> >>>> >> ------------------------------ >> >> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 >> > > > ------------------------------ > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 > ========================================================Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). --bcaec54b4aa2fa57e904d63fc8e1 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

First of all,  I have to concur with Marc and Shana.  Keep the monetary information out till being contacted for the job interview.   

Jillian and Marc, thanks for your input about your interview experiences.  Yes, having an email-based interview with all those questions for me to answer was a surreal experience because I can't personally charm them off the floor like Marc stated.  I did have a video phone interview in 2008 for a non museum job and it was not sufficiently productive on both ends.  As I have stated earlier, it is a bit of challenge from the other side's perspective as I am Deaf.  I do not see it as anything negative as I am very confident in my capabilities.  

Ashley

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:32 PM, Shana West <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

I agree with Marc, Ashley. I was suggesting to say in the cover letter that you are already planning to move to that city for other reasons. Something like, "I have been planning a move to X this spring to be near friends and family/because my partner has a job there/because I have always wanted to make my home there (whatever the reason), and was excited to see this job posting...." That way, you're hinting you'll cover the moving expenses without saying so outright and appearing presumptive.

Especially if it's a place you want to be, then it wouldn't be too far from the truth!

Cheers,

Shana

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:20 AM, Marc A Williams <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Ashley,

 

I have had two museum interviews relatively recently, one by phone and one in person.  The in-person one was in an adjoining state about 2 hours away.  Expenses were not paid.  I believe this is fairly common.  If you are head-hunted (asked by the prospective employer or their search firm to apply), expenses usually are paid.  However, head hunting usually only occurs for experienced employees.  Unless a recent graduate is unusually exceptional in some way, this avenue is not open to them.

 

Personally, I did not like the phone interview.  For one thing, I did not get to see the facilities.  After all, hiring is a two-way street - they have to want me and I have to want them.  For another, I did not get to dazzle them with my charm, interpersonal skills, and aura. ;)  The other thing to remember about interviews is that some organizations do them in two or more tiers.  The first level may be by phone or email or even Skype.  After the first cut, subsequent interviews may be in person.

 

You also asked a question about mentioning you would be willing to pay relocation expenses in your cover letter.  Personally, I would find this a bit premature and perhaps appearing too desperate, which may subliminally make the employer wonder why.  If they contact you back and begin a discussion, that's when it may be appropriate to discuss money.  However, the general rule is not to discuss money until the job is being offered, since it is a package deal - salary, moving expenses, benefits, vacation, attendance at conferences, etc.  Each individual will see this differently, though, so it will depend upon how the specific person receiving your application responds.  I believe that a statement in your cover letter to the effect that you are fully prepared to relocate for the job (without mentioning money) will serve you as well without raising any negative issues.

 

Marc

American Conservation Consortium, Ltd.
     4 Rockville Road
     Broad Brook, CT 06016
     www.conservator.com
     860-386-6058

 

Marc A. Williams, President
     MS in Art Conservation, Winterthur Museum Program
     Former Chief Wooden Objects Conservator, Smithsonian Institution
     Fellow, American Institute for Conservation (AIC)

 

 

----- Original Message -----

From: [log in to unmask]" href="mailto:[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">Ashley Watson

To: [log in to unmask]" href="mailto:[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">[log in to unmask]

Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 11:27 AM

Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

One more thing but very important question to help everyone who are still struggling to find jobs like me so it need to be made as a separate post for more attention here. 

Anyone of you who already have job interviews,  how was it conducted? In person, skype, email, or other means?  

For my two job interviews I had, the interview at Gallaudet University was in person while the National Museum of Natural History was done via email.  Email-based interview was definitely a new experience for me.    

Ashley

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 11:20 AM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Jamie Smith just made a hard-hitting post that truly made me think hard.  I have already been strongly considered about relocating to California to join my friends there if no job offer by May or early summer.   His post helped me realize that being local to few hours away is the key to breaking in.   Now my decision to relocate to that state is 95% certain but need to save a little more for the moving expenses to make it happen.  I can begin interning there.   Washington D.C. is certainly nice but I am only here to either get a job or use my internships at Smithsonian Institute as a "fast track" to a job anywhere but apparently, it is not working too well.  As I said earlier in one of my posts, I had two job interviews and both were, like Jaime Smith stressed,  local.  One with National Museum of Natural History and the other one with Gallaudet University.   Thank you, Jamie Smith. 

Ashley

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 10:58 AM, Wesley S. Creel <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Good Morning Ashley,
Back in the Bronze Age in 1972, I completed my post-graduate education in museum studies at the University of Leicester.  I returned to my hometown, New Orleans.  I could not find a museum job for two years.  Then in the summer of 1974, I was offered -- in the same week -- two jobs...... one job as a curator of anthropology at a university museum..... and, the other job,..... serving as a crew member, delivering a sailboat (ketch) from New Orleans to Tahiti.  I took the curator job and have been working in museums ever since.  The odyssey of finding that first museum job is a recurring story that has been with us for decades.
You may wish to check this list-serve's archives, since this subject has been discussed as long as I have been on this list-serve.
Best Wishes for Success,
Wesley
p.s. four decades later, I still wonder how my life would have changed, if I had taken the job of delivering yachts to distant ports.......
p.p.s.  RE: Job Search......The bottom line is PERSISTANCE.
During my 2 years of looking for that first full-time museum job, I remembered President Coolidge's thoughts on PERSISTANCE............
"Nothing in the world can take the place of Persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan 'Press On' has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race."
Wesley S. Creel
Administrator of Programs
Pink Palace Family of Museums
3050 Central Avenue
Memphis, TN 38111
www.memphismuseums.org
Office 901.636.2370  new telephone number
FAX 901.636.2391  new FAX number

Please consider including the Pink Palace Family of Museums in your charitable giving plans
along with your other charitable interests.
Please visit all our great facilities as well as our website: www.memphismuseums.org
Our mission: The Pink Palace Family of Museums inspires people to learn how history.science, technology and nature shape the mid-South. Through rich collections, thought-provoking exhibitions, and engaging programs, we encourage our diverse community to reflect on the past, understand the present, and influence the future

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--bcaec54b4aa2fa57e904d63fc8e1-- ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 11:49:55 -0600 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Shana West <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates In-Reply-To: <001901ce1043$160e6b20$422b4160$@com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundaryô6d04426a22e5794e04d63fb313 Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> --f46d04426a22e5794e04d63fb313 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I can appreciate what you're saying, Jamie. But honestly, I wonder if it isn't more of a financial hardship on these grads to not have jobs than to spend a few hundred bucks on an interview. I mean, I wouldn't do it for the first interview. But at the second interview level (first via phone), they have a better sense of their chances and it could be a justifiable expense. Especially if they live in cities that are crowded with museum studies graduates--there might not be 10 but rather hundreds of local applicants for every job. But they also wouldn't want to just move to a new place without a job offer in hand just to become a local--especially to cities with fewer opportunities or high living expenses. They're caught between a rock and a hard place. Cheers, Shana On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:52 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]>wrote: > From the Museum perspective, I think a small to medium museum is not going > to consider an out-of-State candidate if they are located more than a > reasonable day trip away from the museum they apply to because the museum > does not have the resources to reimburse each candidate for travel and they > do realize that these candidates are just starting out and do not have the > means to fly in for an interview for an entry level job either. That is why > we keep our search State wide for entry level positions. Please keep in > mind that we typically receive at least 50 resumes for such positions, all > of which have basically the same level of education and experience and at > least 10 of these candidates are fairly local, so there is no shortage of > qualified local candidates. If we did advertise nationwide for such > positions, I would really have a hard time as a human being asking a > candidate to fly in knowing, at this stage in their career, it would cause > them financial hardship when they are competing against so many other > candidates with basically the same credentials. I would really concentrate > my search locally, try and attain an entry level position and then take it > from there. Certainly when you are ready to move on to a higher position, > the search parameters widen and you can cast your net wider as well.**** > > ** ** > > Jamie**** > > ** ** > > *From:* Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] *On > Behalf Of *Shana West > *Sent:* Thursday, February 21, 2013 9:27 AM > *To:* [log in to unmask] > *Subject:* SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for > the recent graduates**** > > ** ** > > I have found it puzzling when museums I applied to in other states weren't > interested because I wasn't local. I moved across the country for my first, > entry-level museum job. Many graduates would jump at the chance for a full > time job, regardless of location. So when grads have come to me asking for > advice on applying out of state, I've told them to say they're already > planning on moving to that city independently of the job (yes, it's a white > lie). That way, the hiring museum won't feel like they have to pay > expenses. **** > > ** ** > > I haven't tried it myself, but I was in a situation where I was actually > moving to a new city and applying for a job. I don't think I would have > been considered had I not already been planning a move. In fact, I'm pretty > sure they asked me on the phone interview, "And you're definitely moving > here?" **** > > ** ** > > Just an idea.**** > > Shana**** > > ** ** > > On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:08 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]> > wrote:**** > > Hi All:**** > > I have posted positions on local sites before, such as MANY (Museum > Association of the State of NY) and I have interviewed and hired candidates > from these postings. Perhaps you need to look at State museum organizations > rather than national organizations to post your resume on. I know from the > Museum perspective, we are not interested in a nationwide search to fill an > entry level position, so we keep the posting local, or at least at the > State level.**** > > **** > > Hope this helps and good luck,**** > > Jamie Smith Quinn**** > > Executive Director**** > > FASNY Museum of Firefighting**** > > **** > > *From:* Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] *On > Behalf Of *Laurie A Sedicino > *Sent:* Wednesday, February 20, 2013 11:08 PM**** > > > *To:* [log in to unmask] > *Subject:* Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent > graduates**** > > **** > > I would also be interested in the answer to Matthew’s question. I have to > agree that - at least for museum field jobs – I have never once experienced > museum search committees using posted resume sources…and I have never been > contacted through these sources. I would like to hear along with Matthew > if you think these are good uses of *such *spare job search time and > energy??**** > > **** > > Thanks**** > > Laurie**** > > **** > ------------------------------ > > *From:* Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]<[log in to unmask]>] > *On Behalf Of *Matthew White > *Sent:* Wednesday, February 20, 2013 4:52 PM > *To:* [log in to unmask] > *Subject:* Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent > graduates**** > > **** > > I have a question for the group that is tangentially related.**** > > **** > > There are several professional organizations that invite those looking for > a job to post their resumes and particulars. (I have posted at both AAM and > AASLH. I am sure there are similar sites in other niches of the field.) I > have also posted on Linked-In. As anyone who has ever done this knows, it > can be kind of time consuming to enter and keep current. **** > > **** > > Has anyone ever gotten contact through one of these services? An > interview? A job?**** > > **** > > For those of you who have hired recently, did you use these services? If > not why not?**** > > **** > > What about Linked-In?**** > > **** > > Personally, I know a lot of people in the job market and even a good > number who hire and I have never heard of ANYONE even being contacted > through one of these services, let alone get a job.**** > > **** > > Does anyone think these are good uses of spare job search time and energy? > **** > > **** > > Matthew White**** > > On Feb 20, 2013, at 4:34 PM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote:**** > > **** > > Hello all, **** > > I want to thank you all for sharing your experiences and the advice. I > already decided to open my search wide open to start somewhere. I had two > job interviews that took the place last November but didn't get the job. I > received a PERSONAL email from a museum to inform me that my professional > package has been forwarded directly to the museum director. So it > certainly passed the human resources wall. So with that, should I check > with them for the status progression? **** > > **** > > One more thing:**** > > In response to Allison Bott, despite my name giving an implication that I > would be a female, I am actually a male. That is alright. I will read the > article in the link you provided as it may apply to me as I am also in the > minority as i am Deaf. So I face the same challenges as others who are in > the minorities. **** > > **** > > Ashley Watson**** > > **** > > On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 4:24 PM, Jillian Shoblock <[log in to unmask]> > wrote:**** > > I have been applying since December 2011 when I graduated with my MA in > Museum Studies an have only had 2 interviews. Do I get frustrated a lot, > yes but I haven't given up hope yet. I do still have an active social life > and work in management in retail. Is that what I want? Definitely not. I > intern at a museum that I love and would love to be able to work at. But > can't afford to hire me so right now I am getting a little of what I love > to do. What I have found is trying to stay positive even though I have > applied to well over 100 positions all dealing with collections management > and most with history, since that is one of my undergraduate degrees, is > what keeps me going. Try to enjoy your life outside the museum an continue > to visit museums. If you can't find a job in I e and have to work elsewhere > then volunteer so you still get your fill. I know it sucks, trust me all my > friends have full time jobs and are "living the life" but I have to believe > that my time will come. Also my one friend keeps telling me to look at > higher Ed jobs like academic advising if you have a masters. Just a > thought. Good luck and keep your head up! > > Jillian > > Sent from my iPhone**** > > > On Feb 20, 2013, at 3:58 PM, "Jentzsch, Tracy" <[log in to unmask]> > wrote: > > > Ashley, for you and others searching for job leads, I would recommend a > > free resource we offer through the University of Delaware's Museum > Studies > > Program. MuseWeekly is our weekly electronic news that provides job > > posts, internships, conferences, calls for papers, announcements and news > > related to all things "museum". We never rent or sell our list, and > there > > is always a plethora of good leads. You can sign up for this free > > resource by going to our website, www.udel.edu/museumstudies and filing > in > > the three question form on the index page. Good luck to you. > > > > > > > > Tracy H. Jentzsch > > Staff Assistant, Museum Studies Program > > University of Delaware > > 302.831.1251 > > Www.udel.edu/museumstudies > > > > > > > > > > > > On 2/20/13 3:49 PM, "Ashley Watson" <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > > > >> Hello, > >> I graduated with masters in the museum studies at Syracuse University > >> last May and have not found a job yet despite aggressively applying for > >> various openings within my experience and skill range. I have completed > >> an internship at National Museum of Natural History in the exhibits > >> department and is currently a zooarchaeological/collections intern at > the > >> Museum Support Center till this May. Any recent graduates here that > >> have the same frustrating experience? Those internships certainly help > >> keep me sane professionally and personally but I certainly need to begin > >> LIVING. I want to add one thing that I was more than qualified for one > >> position at National Museum of Natural History but didn't break through > >> the annoying human resources "wall". My colleague who was qualified to > >> the maximum also applied for the same position got the same result. > >> > >> ========================================================= > >> Important Subscriber Information: > >> > >> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at > >> http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed > >> information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail > >> message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message > should > >> read "help" (without the quotes). > >> > >> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message > to > >> [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read > >> "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). > > > > ========================================================= > > Important Subscriber Information: > >**** > > > The Museum-L FAQ file is located at > http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed > information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail > message to [log in to unmask] .. The body of the message should > read "help" (without the quotes).**** > > > > > > If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message > to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read > "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). > > ========================================================= > Important Subscriber Information: > > The Museum-L FAQ file is located at > http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed > information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail > message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should > read "help" (without the quotes). > > If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to > [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read > "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes).**** > > **** > > **** > ------------------------------ > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 **** > > **** > > **** > ------------------------------ > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 **** > > **** > ------------------------------ > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 **** > > ** ** > ------------------------------ > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 **** > > ** ** > > ** ** > ------------------------------ > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 **** > > ------------------------------ > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 > ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). --f46d04426a22e5794e04d63fb313 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I can appreciate what you're saying, Jamie. But honestly, I wonder if it isn't more of a financial hardship on these grads to not have jobs than to spend a few hundred bucks on an interview. I mean, I wouldn't do it for the first interview. But at the second interview level (first via phone), they have a better sense of their chances and it could be a justifiable expense. Especially if they live in cities that are crowded with museum studies graduates--there might not be 10 but rather hundreds of local applicants for every job. But they also wouldn't want to just move to a new place without a job offer in hand just to become a local--especially to cities with fewer opportunities or high living expenses. They're caught between a rock and a hard place.

Cheers,

Shana

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:52 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

From the Museum perspective, I think a small to medium museum is not going to consider an out-of-State candidate if they are located more than a reasonable day trip away from the museum they apply to because the museum does not have the resources to reimburse each candidate for travel and they do realize that these candidates are just starting out and do not have the means to fly in for an interview for an entry level job either. That is why we keep our search State wide for entry level positions. Please keep in mind that we typically receive at least 50 resumes for such positions, all of which have basically the same level of education and experience and at least 10 of these candidates are fairly local, so there is no shortage of qualified local candidates. If we did advertise nationwide for such positions, I would really have a hard time as a human being asking a candidate to fly in knowing, at this stage in their career, it would cause them financial hardship when they are competing against so many other candidates with basically the same credentials. I would really concentrate my search locally, try and attain an entry level position and then take it from there. Certainly when you are ready to move on to a higher position, the search parameters widen and you can cast your net wider as well.

 

Jamie

 

From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Shana West
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 9:27 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

 

I have found it puzzling when museums I applied to in other states weren't interested because I wasn't local. I moved across the country for my first, entry-level museum job. Many graduates would jump at the chance for a full time job, regardless of location. So when grads have come to me asking for advice on applying out of state, I've told them to say they're already planning on moving to that city independently of the job (yes, it's a white lie). That way, the hiring museum won't feel like they have to pay expenses. 

 

I haven't tried it myself, but I was in a situation where I was actually moving to a new city and applying for a job. I don't think I would have been considered had I not already been planning a move. In fact, I'm pretty sure they asked me on the phone interview, "And you're definitely moving here?" 

 

Just an idea.

Shana

 

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:08 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Hi All:

I have posted positions on local sites before, such as MANY (Museum Association of the State of NY) and I have interviewed and hired candidates from these postings. Perhaps you need to look at State museum organizations rather than national organizations to post your resume on. I know from the Museum perspective, we are not interested in a nationwide search to fill an entry level position, so we keep the posting local, or at least at the State level.

 

Hope this helps and good luck,

Jamie Smith Quinn

Executive Director

FASNY Museum of Firefighting

 

From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Laurie A Sedicino
Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 11:08 PM

To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

 

I would also be interested in the answer to Matthew’s question.  I have to agree that - at least for museum field jobs – I have never once experienced museum search committees using posted resume sources…and I have never been contacted through these sources.  I would like to hear along with Matthew if you think these are good uses of such spare job search time and energy??

 

Thanks

Laurie

 

---

From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Matthew White
Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 4:52 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

 

I have a question for the group that is tangentially related.

 

There are several professional organizations that invite those looking for a job to post their resumes and particulars. (I have posted at both AAM and AASLH. I am sure there are similar sites in other niches of the field.) I have also posted on Linked-In. As anyone who has ever done this knows, it can be kind of time consuming to enter and keep current. 

 

Has anyone ever gotten contact through one of these services? An interview? A job?

 

For those of you who have hired recently, did you use these services? If not why not?

 

What about Linked-In?

 

Personally, I know a lot of people in the job market and even a good number who hire and I have never heard of ANYONE even being contacted through one of these services, let alone get a job.

 

Does anyone think these are good uses of spare job search time and energy?

 

Matthew White

On Feb 20, 2013, at 4:34 PM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

 

Hello all,  

   I want to thank you all for sharing your experiences and the advice.  I already decided to open my search wide open to start somewhere.   I had two job interviews that took the place last November but didn't get the job. I received a PERSONAL email from a museum to inform me that my professional package has been forwarded directly to the museum director.  So it certainly passed the human resources wall. So with that, should I check with them for the status progression?   

 

One more thing:

In response to Allison Bott,  despite my name giving an implication that I would be a female, I am actually a male. That is alright.  I will read the article in the link you provided as it may apply to me as I am also in the minority as i am Deaf.   So I face the same challenges as others who are in the minorities. 

 

Ashley Watson

 

On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 4:24 PM, Jillian Shoblock <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

I have been applying since December 2011 when I graduated with my MA in Museum Studies an have only had 2 interviews. Do I get frustrated a lot, yes but I haven't given up hope yet. I do still have an active social life and work in management in retail. Is that what I want? Definitely not. I intern at a museum that I love and would love to be able to work at. But can't afford to hire me so right now I am getting a little of what I love to do. What I have found is trying to stay positive even though I have applied to well over 100 positions all dealing with collections management and most with history, since that is one of my undergraduate degrees, is what keeps me going. Try to enjoy your life outside the museum an continue to visit museums. If you can't find a job in I e and have to work elsewhere then volunteer so you still get your fill. I know it sucks, trust me all my friends have full time jobs and are "living the life" but I have to believe that my time will come. Also my one friend keeps telling me to look at higher Ed jobs like academic advising if you have a masters. Just a thought. Good luck and keep your head up!

Jillian

Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 20, 2013, at 3:58 PM, "Jentzsch, Tracy" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> Ashley, for you and others searching for job leads, I would recommend a
> free resource we offer through the University of Delaware's Museum Studies
> Program.  MuseWeekly is our weekly electronic news that provides job
> posts, internships, conferences, calls for papers, announcements and news
> related to all things "museum".  We never rent or sell our list, and there
> is always a plethora of good leads.  You can sign up for this free
> resource by going to our website, www.udel.edu/museumstudies and filing in
> the three question form on the index page.  Good luck to you.
>
>
>
> Tracy H. Jentzsch
> Staff Assistant, Museum Studies Program
> University of Delaware
> 302.831.1251
> Www.udel.edu/museumstudies
>
>
>
>
>
> On 2/20/13 3:49 PM, "Ashley Watson" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>> Hello,
>>  I graduated with masters in the museum studies at Syracuse University
>> last May and have not found a job yet despite aggressively applying for
>> various openings within my experience and skill range. I have completed
>> an internship at National Museum of Natural History in the exhibits
>> department and is currently a zooarchaeological/collections intern at the
>> Museum Support Center till this May.   Any recent graduates here that
>> have the same frustrating experience?   Those internships certainly help
>> keep me sane professionally and personally but I certainly need to begin
>> LIVING. I want to add one thing that I was more than qualified for one
>> position at National Museum of Natural History but didn't break through
>> the annoying human resources "wall". My colleague who was qualified to
>> the maximum also applied for the same position got the same result.
>>
>> =========================================================
>> Important Subscriber Information:
>>
>> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at
>> http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed
>> information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail
>> message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should
>> read "help" (without the quotes).
>>
>> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to
>> [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read
>> "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes).
>
> =========================================================
> Important Subscriber Information:
>

> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] .. The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes).

>
> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes).

=========================================================
Important Subscriber Information:

The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes).

If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes).

 

 

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--f46d04426a22e5794e04d63fb313-- ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 18:03:48 +0000 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: "Yearous, Jenny Dee" <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates In-Reply-To: <00a401ce0feb$564840b0$02d8c210$@net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> Hi all, As one who hires I would like to put my two cents in. I think Kathie has a great idea of working with a small museum volunteering to write a grant that will help pay for you to do a job. Proven grant writing is always a plus later on. I also want to put in a plug for the small museums in general and for museums in out of the way places. I really feel that one of the reasons I got my current job 15 yrs ago was I was willing to go to North Dakota (this was well before they had money) at that time there were only two qualified candidates for the position, I was one of them :) Some people thought I was nuts for wanting to go to ND but I have a good paying job to this day because of it. I had classmates who were willing to work in small operations, move to another state and many times be the only paid employee and they got jobs quickly. Other classmates only wanted to work in New York, Chicago, LA etc or work for large institutions and it took them years to find jobs. So stay flexible, be willing to go places, work in any size institution and yes you might have to clean toilets, put up an exhibit, accession five collections and lead three tours (all in one day) but you will gain valuable experience and in a couple of years if you don't just love it there, you can start looking for a job in a larger museum somewhere else. Jenny Yearous Curator of Collections Management State Historical Society of North Dakota P.S. Sorry to say, We don't have any job openings right now. -----Original Message----- From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Kathie Gow Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 10:24 PM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates Hi Ashley and Jillian. There is another avenue to explore while waiting for a full-time museum job, especially if you're already connected with a museum where you'd like to work -- and if you have some other work, at least part-time. Find out what granting organizations might be available in your state, or in your area of interest, and then ask the museum if they would sponsor you working on a specific project for them if you got a grant for it. I have been working on a volunteer basis for a small historical society museum for about three years, eventually as curator (still volunteer), and needed to find a way to make some money while working there so I could keep doing it. I saw an ad (perhaps here on MUSEUM-L) for a Collections Manager for the Hanover, Mass., Historical Society, to do all the sorts of things I was already doing for our Historical Society museum. They had money to fund the person for 650 hours, plus money for archival supplies, all paid from a Mass. Community Preservation grant. So I got our Historical Society to sponsor me, and I wrote a grant very much like the Hanover position description for OUR Community Preservation Committee, including cataloging new acquisitions, re-cataloging old acquisitions, adding images for each record (photographing or scanning), rehousing artifacts in archival enclosures, recommending items for deaccession, overseeing volunteers, etc... It is largely a Collection inventory project, but your project could be anything you're passionate about -- or the museum really needs. I'm still finishing up Year 1 of the grant, and I've been approved for a second year. It only works out to a part-time job, but it allows me to get paid for doing what the museum needs and what I love to do. If our local area is any indication, there are lots of small historical society museums across the country with volunteer staffs who have notable collections and no money or in-house expertise to work on them. This takes some time to set up, but a year or two of part-time grant work just might turn into a job. As for writing the grant, a lot of granting organizations include past recipients' projects and sample applications on their websites, which is very helpful. Good luck! --Kathie Kathie Gow Oral History Producer http://www.wordspicturesstories.com Curator, Hatfield Historical Museum http://hatfieldhistory.weebly.com -----Original Message----- From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Jillian Shoblock Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 4:25 PM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates I have been applying since December 2011 when I graduated with my MA in Museum Studies an have only had 2 interviews. Do I get frustrated a lot, yes but I haven't given up hope yet. I do still have an active social life and work in management in retail. Is that what I want? Definitely not. I intern at a museum that I love and would love to be able to work at. But can't afford to hire me so right now I am getting a little of what I love to do. What I have found is trying to stay positive even though I have applied to well over 100 positions all dealing with collections management and most with history, since that is one of my undergraduate degrees, is what keeps me going. Try to enjoy your life outside the museum an continue to visit museums. If you can't find a job in I e and have to work elsewhere then volunteer so you still get your fill. I know it sucks, trust me all my friends have full time jobs and are "living the life" but I have to believe that my time will come. Also my one friend keeps telling me to look at higher Ed jobs like academic advising if you have a masters. Just a thought. Good luck and keep your head up! Jillian Sent from my iPhone On Feb 20, 2013, at 3:58 PM, "Jentzsch, Tracy" <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > Ashley, for you and others searching for job leads, I would recommend > a free resource we offer through the University of Delaware's Museum > Studies Program. MuseWeekly is our weekly electronic news that > provides job posts, internships, conferences, calls for papers, > announcements and news related to all things "museum". We never rent > or sell our list, and there is always a plethora of good leads. You > can sign up for this free resource by going to our website, > www.udel.edu/museumstudies and filing in the three question form on the index page. Good luck to you. > > > > Tracy H. Jentzsch > Staff Assistant, Museum Studies Program University of Delaware > 302.831.1251 > Www.udel.edu/museumstudies > > > > > > On 2/20/13 3:49 PM, "Ashley Watson" <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > >> Hello, >> I graduated with masters in the museum studies at Syracuse >> University last May and have not found a job yet despite aggressively >> applying for various openings within my experience and skill range. I >> have completed an internship at National Museum of Natural History in >> the exhibits department and is currently a zooarchaeological/collections intern at the >> Museum Support Center till this May. Any recent graduates here that >> have the same frustrating experience? Those internships certainly help >> keep me sane professionally and personally but I certainly need to >> begin LIVING. I want to add one thing that I was more than qualified >> for one position at National Museum of Natural History but didn't >> break through the annoying human resources "wall". My colleague who >> was qualified to the maximum also applied for the same position got the same result. >> >> ========================================================= >> Important Subscriber Information: >> >> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at >> http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed >> information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail >> message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message >> should read "help" (without the quotes). >> >> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail >> message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message >> should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). > > ========================================================= > Important Subscriber Information: > > The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). > > If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message > to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 13:39:56 -0500 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Regan Brooks <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_050FD9AC1B2548458D8B9DE6773EBD482AE58A1CB3GC51_" Message-ID: <050FD9AC1B2548458D8B9DE6773EBD482AE58A1CB3@GC51> --_000_050FD9AC1B2548458D8B9DE6773EBD482AE58A1CB3GC51_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Keep in mind also that there are those museums out there that while they may not assist with travel costs, due provide housing options for their interns. We are a small county run institution and the majority of our interns are from out of state and even out of country. We are fortunate in that a board member has donated a rental property that we use as intern housing. So far, I've not had an intern complain regarding the cost of getting here (or getting home) nor have they even inquired about the museum covering those costs. Overwhelmingly, the majority of the applicants we receive are not local (and that is with a large number of colleges and universities within daytrip distance). Most of these students want something in an area that they've either perhaps not experienced before or parallels with their studies. -Regan From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Shana West Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 12:50 PM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates I can appreciate what you're saying, Jamie. But honestly, I wonder if it isn't more of a financial hardship on these grads to not have jobs than to spend a few hundred bucks on an interview. I mean, I wouldn't do it for the first interview. But at the second interview level (first via phone), they have a better sense of their chances and it could be a justifiable expense. Especially if they live in cities that are crowded with museum studies graduates--there might not be 10 but rather hundreds of local applicants for every job. But they also wouldn't want to just move to a new place without a job offer in hand just to become a local--especially to cities with fewer opportunities or high living expenses. They're caught between a rock and a hard place. Cheers, Shana On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:52 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]> wrote: From the Museum perspective, I think a small to medium museum is not going to consider an out-of-State candidate if they are located more than a reasonable day trip away from the museum they apply to because the museum does not have the resources to reimburse each candidate for travel and they do realize that these candidates are just starting out and do not have the means to fly in for an interview for an entry level job either. That is why we keep our search State wide for entry level positions. Please keep in mind that we typically receive at least 50 resumes for such positions, all of which have basically the same level of education and experience and at least 10 of these candidates are fairly local, so there is no shortage of qualified local candidates. If we did advertise nationwide for such positions, I would really have a hard time as a human being asking a candidate to fly in knowing, at this stage in their career, it would cause them financial hardship when they are competing against so many other candidates with basically the same credentials. I would really concentrate my search locally, try and attain an entry level position and then take it from there. Certainly when you are ready to move on to a higher position, the search parameters widen and you can cast your net wider as well. Jamie From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Shana West Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 9:27 AM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates I have found it puzzling when museums I applied to in other states weren't interested because I wasn't local. I moved across the country for my first, entry-level museum job. Many graduates would jump at the chance for a full time job, regardless of location. So when grads have come to me asking for advice on applying out of state, I've told them to say they're already planning on moving to that city independently of the job (yes, it's a white lie). That way, the hiring museum won't feel like they have to pay expenses. I haven't tried it myself, but I was in a situation where I was actually moving to a new city and applying for a job. I don't think I would have been considered had I not already been planning a move. In fact, I'm pretty sure they asked me on the phone interview, "And you're definitely moving here?" Just an idea. Shana On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:08 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]> wrote: Hi All: I have posted positions on local sites before, such as MANY (Museum Association of the State of NY) and I have interviewed and hired candidates from these postings. Perhaps you need to look at State museum organizations rather than national organizations to post your resume on. I know from the Museum perspective, we are not interested in a nationwide search to fill an entry level position, so we keep the posting local, or at least at the State level. Hope this helps and good luck, Jamie Smith Quinn Executive Director FASNY Museum of Firefighting From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Laurie A Sedicino Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 11:08 PM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates I would also be interested in the answer to Matthew's question. I have to agree that - at least for museum field jobs - I have never once experienced museum search committees using posted resume sources...and I have never been contacted through these sources. I would like to hear along with Matthew if you think these are good uses of such spare job search time and energy?? Thanks Laurie ________________________________ From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Matthew White Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 4:52 PM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates I have a question for the group that is tangentially related. There are several professional organizations that invite those looking for a job to post their resumes and particulars. (I have posted at both AAM and AASLH. I am sure there are similar sites in other niches of the field.) I have also posted on Linked-In. As anyone who has ever done this knows, it can be kind of time consuming to enter and keep current. Has anyone ever gotten contact through one of these services? An interview? A job? For those of you who have hired recently, did you use these services? If not why not? What about Linked-In? Personally, I know a lot of people in the job market and even a good number who hire and I have never heard of ANYONE even being contacted through one of these services, let alone get a job. Does anyone think these are good uses of spare job search time and energy? Matthew White On Feb 20, 2013, at 4:34 PM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote: Hello all, I want to thank you all for sharing your experiences and the advice. I already decided to open my search wide open to start somewhere. I had two job interviews that took the place last November but didn't get the job. I received a PERSONAL email from a museum to inform me that my professional package has been forwarded directly to the museum director. So it certainly passed the human resources wall. So with that, should I check with them for the status progression? One more thing: In response to Allison Bott, despite my name giving an implication that I would be a female, I am actually a male. That is alright. I will read the article in the link you provided as it may apply to me as I am also in the minority as i am Deaf. So I face the same challenges as others who are in the minorities. Ashley Watson On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 4:24 PM, Jillian Shoblock <[log in to unmask]> wrote: I have been applying since December 2011 when I graduated with my MA in Museum Studies an have only had 2 interviews. Do I get frustrated a lot, yes but I haven't given up hope yet. I do still have an active social life and work in management in retail. Is that what I want? Definitely not. I intern at a museum that I love and would love to be able to work at. But can't afford to hire me so right now I am getting a little of what I love to do. What I have found is trying to stay positive even though I have applied to well over 100 positions all dealing with collections management and most with history, since that is one of my undergraduate degrees, is what keeps me going. Try to enjoy your life outside the museum an continue to visit museums. If you can't find a job in I e and have to work elsewhere then volunteer so you still get your fill. I know it sucks, trust me all my friends have full time jobs and are "living the life" but I have to believe that my time will come. Also my one friend keeps telling me to look at higher Ed jobs like academic advising if you have a masters. Just a thought. Good luck and keep your head up! Jillian Sent from my iPhone On Feb 20, 2013, at 3:58 PM, "Jentzsch, Tracy" <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > Ashley, for you and others searching for job leads, I would recommend a > free resource we offer through the University of Delaware's Museum Studies > Program. MuseWeekly is our weekly electronic news that provides job > posts, internships, conferences, calls for papers, announcements and news > related to all things "museum". We never rent or sell our list, and there > is always a plethora of good leads. You can sign up for this free > resource by going to our website, www.udel.edu/museumstudies and filing in > the three question form on the index page. Good luck to you. > > > > Tracy H. Jentzsch > Staff Assistant, Museum Studies Program > University of Delaware > 302.831.1251 > Www.udel.edu/museumstudies > > > > > > On 2/20/13 3:49 PM, "Ashley Watson" <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > >> Hello, >> I graduated with masters in the museum studies at Syracuse University >> last May and have not found a job yet despite aggressively applying for >> various openings within my experience and skill range. I have completed >> an internship at National Museum of Natural History in the exhibits >> department and is currently a zooarchaeological/collections intern at the >> Museum Support Center till this May. Any recent graduates here that >> have the same frustrating experience? Those internships certainly help >> keep me sane professionally and personally but I certainly need to begin >> LIVING. I want to add one thing that I was more than qualified for one >> position at National Museum of Natural History but didn't break through >> the annoying human resources "wall". My colleague who was qualified to >> the maximum also applied for the same position got the same result. >> >> ========================================================= >> Important Subscriber Information: >> >> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at >> http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed >> information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail >> message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should >> read "help" (without the quotes). >> >> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to >> [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read >> "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). > > ========================================================= > Important Subscriber Information: > > The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] .. The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). > > If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ________________________________ To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 ________________________________ To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 ________________________________ To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 ________________________________ To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 ________________________________ To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 ________________________________ To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 ________________________________ To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 Pursuant to North Carolina General Statute, Chapter 132, email correspondence to and from this address may be considered public record under the North Carolina Public Records Law and may be disclosed to third parties. ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). --_000_050FD9AC1B2548458D8B9DE6773EBD482AE58A1CB3GC51_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Keep in mind also that there are those museums out there that while they may not assist with travel costs, due provide housing options for their interns. We are a small county run institution and the majority of our interns are from out of state and even out of country. We are fortunate in that a board member has donated a rental property that we use as intern housing. So far, I’ve not had an intern complain regarding the cost of getting here (or getting home) nor have they even inquired about the museum covering those costs. Overwhelmingly, the majority of the applicants we receive are not local (and that is with a large number of colleges and universities within daytrip distance). Most of these students want something in an area that they’ve either perhaps not experienced before or parallels with their studies.

 

-Regan

 

From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Shana West
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 12:50 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

 

I can appreciate what you're saying, Jamie. But honestly, I wonder if it isn't more of a financial hardship on these grads to not have jobs than to spend a few hundred bucks on an interview. I mean, I wouldn't do it for the first interview. But at the second interview level (first via phone), they have a better sense of their chances and it could be a justifiable expense. Especially if they live in cities that are crowded with museum studies graduates--there might not be 10 but rather hundreds of local applicants for every job. But they also wouldn't want to just move to a new place without a job offer in hand just to become a local--especially to cities with fewer opportunities or high living expenses. They're caught between a rock and a hard place.

Cheers,

Shana

 

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:52 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

From the Museum perspective, I think a small to medium museum is not going to consider an out-of-State candidate if they are located more than a reasonable day trip away from the museum they apply to because the museum does not have the resources to reimburse each candidate for travel and they do realize that these candidates are just starting out and do not have the means to fly in for an interview for an entry level job either. That is why we keep our search State wide for entry level positions. Please keep in mind that we typically receive at least 50 resumes for such positions, all of which have basically the same level of education and experience and at least 10 of these candidates are fairly local, so there is no shortage of qualified local candidates. If we did advertise nationwide for such positions, I would really have a hard time as a human being asking a candidate to fly in knowing, at this stage in their career, it would cause them financial hardship when they are competing against so many other candidates with basically the same credentials. I would really concentrate my search locally, try and attain an entry level position and then take it from there. Certainly when you are ready to move on to a higher position, the search parameters widen and you can cast your net wider as well.

 

Jamie

 

From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Shana West
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 9:27 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

 

I have found it puzzling when museums I applied to in other states weren't interested because I wasn't local. I moved across the country for my first, entry-level museum job. Many graduates would jump at the chance for a full time job, regardless of location. So when grads have come to me asking for advice on applying out of state, I've told them to say they're already planning on moving to that city independently of the job (yes, it's a white lie). That way, the hiring museum won't feel like they have to pay expenses. 

 

I haven't tried it myself, but I was in a situation where I was actually moving to a new city and applying for a job. I don't think I would have been considered had I not already been planning a move. In fact, I'm pretty sure they asked me on the phone interview, "And you're definitely moving here?" 

 

Just an idea.

Shana

 

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:08 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Hi All:

I have posted positions on local sites before, such as MANY (Museum Association of the State of NY) and I have interviewed and hired candidates from these postings. Perhaps you need to look at State museum organizations rather than national organizations to post your resume on. I know from the Museum perspective, we are not interested in a nationwide search to fill an entry level position, so we keep the posting local, or at least at the State level.

 

Hope this helps and good luck,

Jamie Smith Quinn

Executive Director

FASNY Museum of Firefighting

 

From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Laurie A Sedicino
Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 11:08 PM

To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

 

I would also be interested in the answer to Matthew’s question.  I have to agree that - at least for museum field jobs – I have never once experienced museum search committees using posted resume sources…and I have never been contacted through these sources.  I would like to hear along with Matthew if you think these are good uses of such spare job search time and energy??

 

Thanks

Laurie

 

---

From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Matthew White
Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 4:52 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

 

I have a question for the group that is tangentially related.

 

There are several professional organizations that invite those looking for a job to post their resumes and particulars. (I have posted at both AAM and AASLH. I am sure there are similar sites in other niches of the field.) I have also posted on Linked-In. As anyone who has ever done this knows, it can be kind of time consuming to enter and keep current. 

 

Has anyone ever gotten contact through one of these services? An interview? A job?

 

For those of you who have hired recently, did you use these services? If not why not?

 

What about Linked-In?

 

Personally, I know a lot of people in the job market and even a good number who hire and I have never heard of ANYONE even being contacted through one of these services, let alone get a job.

 

Does anyone think these are good uses of spare job search time and energy?

 

Matthew White

On Feb 20, 2013, at 4:34 PM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

 

Hello all,  

   I want to thank you all for sharing your experiences and the advice.  I already decided to open my search wide open to start somewhere.   I had two job interviews that took the place last November but didn't get the job. I received a PERSONAL email from a museum to inform me that my professional package has been forwarded directly to the museum director.  So it certainly passed the human resources wall. So with that, should I check with them for the status progression?   

 

One more thing:

In response to Allison Bott,  despite my name giving an implication that I would be a female, I am actually a male. That is alright.  I will read the article in the link you provided as it may apply to me as I am also in the minority as i am Deaf.   So I face the same challenges as others who are in the minorities. 

 

Ashley Watson

 

On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 4:24 PM, Jillian Shoblock <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

I have been applying since December 2011 when I graduated with my MA in Museum Studies an have only had 2 interviews. Do I get frustrated a lot, yes but I haven't given up hope yet. I do still have an active social life and work in management in retail. Is that what I want? Definitely not. I intern at a museum that I love and would love to be able to work at. But can't afford to hire me so right now I am getting a little of what I love to do. What I have found is trying to stay positive even though I have applied to well over 100 positions all dealing with collections management and most with history, since that is one of my undergraduate degrees, is what keeps me going. Try to enjoy your life outside the museum an continue to visit museums. If you can't find a job in I e and have to work elsewhere then volunteer so you still get your fill. I know it sucks, trust me all my friends have full time jobs and are "living the life" but I have to believe that my time will come. Also my one friend keeps telling me to look at higher Ed jobs like academic advising if you have a masters. Just a thought. Good luck and keep your head up!

Jillian

Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 20, 2013, at 3:58 PM, "Jentzsch, Tracy" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> Ashley, for you and others searching for job leads, I would recommend a
> free resource we offer through the University of Delaware's Museum Studies
> Program.  MuseWeekly is our weekly electronic news that provides job
> posts, internships, conferences, calls for papers, announcements and news
> related to all things "museum".  We never rent or sell our list, and there
> is always a plethora of good leads.  You can sign up for this free
> resource by going to our website, www.udel.edu/museumstudies and filing in
> the three question form on the index page.  Good luck to you.
>
>
>
> Tracy H. Jentzsch
> Staff Assistant, Museum Studies Program
> University of Delaware
> 302.831.1251
> Www.udel.edu/museumstudies
>
>
>
>
>
> On 2/20/13 3:49 PM, "Ashley Watson" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>> Hello,
>>  I graduated with masters in the museum studies at Syracuse University
>> last May and have not found a job yet despite aggressively applying for
>> various openings within my experience and skill range. I have completed
>> an internship at National Museum of Natural History in the exhibits
>> department and is currently a zooarchaeological/collections intern at the
>> Museum Support Center till this May.   Any recent graduates here that
>> have the same frustrating experience?   Those internships certainly help
>> keep me sane professionally and personally but I certainly need to begin
>> LIVING. I want to add one thing that I was more than qualified for one
>> position at National Museum of Natural History but didn't break through
>> the annoying human resources "wall". My colleague who was qualified to
>> the maximum also applied for the same position got the same result.
>>
>> =========================================================
>> Important Subscriber Information:
>>
>> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at
>> http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed
>> information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail
>> message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should
>> read "help" (without the quotes).
>>
>> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to
>> [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read
>> "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes).
>
> =========================================================
> Important Subscriber Information:
>

> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] .. The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes).

>
> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes).

=========================================================
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--_000_050FD9AC1B2548458D8B9DE6773EBD482AE58A1CB3GC51_-- ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 13:40:40 -0500 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Linda Norris <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary¼aec555503e6118cb04d640691b Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> --bcaec555503e6118cb04d640691b Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I'll take a contrarian view at the moment. How many museum studies programs disclose the full details about how many of their students find, within a reasonable amount of time, a real job, not an internship, part-time or short term work? Is there any way to compare those statistics among programs? Why does the field not ask for that? And, as brought up in a conversation among colleagues at the Small Museum Association conference this week, are museums complicit somehow in focusing on internships and contract positions, because it allows them to do more with less? And if so, how does gender play a role and how does the field (that's you and me) feel about it? Linda On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:49 PM, Shana West <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > I can appreciate what you're saying, Jamie. But honestly, I wonder if it > isn't more of a financial hardship on these grads to not have jobs than to > spend a few hundred bucks on an interview. I mean, I wouldn't do it for the > first interview. But at the second interview level (first via phone), they > have a better sense of their chances and it could be a justifiable expense. > Especially if they live in cities that are crowded with museum studies > graduates--there might not be 10 but rather hundreds of local applicants > for every job. But they also wouldn't want to just move to a new place > without a job offer in hand just to become a local--especially to cities > with fewer opportunities or high living expenses. They're caught between a > rock and a hard place. > Cheers, > Shana > > > On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:52 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]>wrote: > >> From the Museum perspective, I think a small to medium museum is not >> going to consider an out-of-State candidate if they are located more than a >> reasonable day trip away from the museum they apply to because the museum >> does not have the resources to reimburse each candidate for travel and they >> do realize that these candidates are just starting out and do not have the >> means to fly in for an interview for an entry level job either. That is why >> we keep our search State wide for entry level positions. Please keep in >> mind that we typically receive at least 50 resumes for such positions, all >> of which have basically the same level of education and experience and at >> least 10 of these candidates are fairly local, so there is no shortage of >> qualified local candidates. If we did advertise nationwide for such >> positions, I would really have a hard time as a human being asking a >> candidate to fly in knowing, at this stage in their career, it would cause >> them financial hardship when they are competing against so many other >> candidates with basically the same credentials. I would really concentrate >> my search locally, try and attain an entry level position and then take it >> from there. Certainly when you are ready to move on to a higher position, >> the search parameters widen and you can cast your net wider as well.**** >> >> ** ** >> >> Jamie**** >> >> ** ** >> >> *From:* Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] *On >> Behalf Of *Shana West >> *Sent:* Thursday, February 21, 2013 9:27 AM >> *To:* [log in to unmask] >> *Subject:* SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for >> the recent graduates**** >> >> ** ** >> >> I have found it puzzling when museums I applied to in other states >> weren't interested because I wasn't local. I moved across the country for >> my first, entry-level museum job. Many graduates would jump at the chance >> for a full time job, regardless of location. So when grads have come to me >> asking for advice on applying out of state, I've told them to say they're >> already planning on moving to that city independently of the job (yes, it's >> a white lie). That way, the hiring museum won't feel like they have to pay >> expenses. **** >> >> ** ** >> >> I haven't tried it myself, but I was in a situation where I was actually >> moving to a new city and applying for a job. I don't think I would have >> been considered had I not already been planning a move. In fact, I'm pretty >> sure they asked me on the phone interview, "And you're definitely moving >> here?" **** >> >> ** ** >> >> Just an idea.**** >> >> Shana**** >> >> ** ** >> >> On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:08 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]> >> wrote:**** >> >> Hi All:**** >> >> I have posted positions on local sites before, such as MANY (Museum >> Association of the State of NY) and I have interviewed and hired candidates >> from these postings. Perhaps you need to look at State museum organizations >> rather than national organizations to post your resume on. I know from the >> Museum perspective, we are not interested in a nationwide search to fill an >> entry level position, so we keep the posting local, or at least at the >> State level.**** >> >> **** >> >> Hope this helps and good luck,**** >> >> Jamie Smith Quinn**** >> >> Executive Director**** >> >> FASNY Museum of Firefighting**** >> >> **** >> >> *From:* Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] *On >> Behalf Of *Laurie A Sedicino >> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 20, 2013 11:08 PM**** >> >> >> *To:* [log in to unmask] >> *Subject:* Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent >> graduates**** >> >> **** >> >> I would also be interested in the answer to Matthew’s question. I have >> to agree that - at least for museum field jobs – I have never once >> experienced museum search committees using posted resume sources…and I have >> never been contacted through these sources. I would like to hear along >> with Matthew if you think these are good uses of *such *spare job search >> time and energy??**** >> >> **** >> >> Thanks**** >> >> Laurie**** >> >> **** >> ------------------------------ >> >> *From:* Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]<[log in to unmask]>] >> *On Behalf Of *Matthew White >> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 20, 2013 4:52 PM >> *To:* [log in to unmask] >> *Subject:* Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent >> graduates**** >> >> **** >> >> I have a question for the group that is tangentially related.**** >> >> **** >> >> There are several professional organizations that invite those looking >> for a job to post their resumes and particulars. (I have posted at both AAM >> and AASLH. I am sure there are similar sites in other niches of the field.) >> I have also posted on Linked-In. As anyone who has ever done this knows, it >> can be kind of time consuming to enter and keep current. **** >> >> **** >> >> Has anyone ever gotten contact through one of these services? An >> interview? A job?**** >> >> **** >> >> For those of you who have hired recently, did you use these services? If >> not why not?**** >> >> **** >> >> What about Linked-In?**** >> >> **** >> >> Personally, I know a lot of people in the job market and even a good >> number who hire and I have never heard of ANYONE even being contacted >> through one of these services, let alone get a job.**** >> >> **** >> >> Does anyone think these are good uses of spare job search time and energy? >> **** >> >> **** >> >> Matthew White**** >> >> On Feb 20, 2013, at 4:34 PM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote:**** >> >> **** >> >> Hello all, **** >> >> I want to thank you all for sharing your experiences and the advice. >> I already decided to open my search wide open to start somewhere. I had >> two job interviews that took the place last November but didn't get the >> job. I received a PERSONAL email from a museum to inform me that my >> professional package has been forwarded directly to the museum director. >> So it certainly passed the human resources wall. So with that, should I >> check with them for the status progression? **** >> >> **** >> >> One more thing:**** >> >> In response to Allison Bott, despite my name giving an implication that >> I would be a female, I am actually a male. That is alright. I will read >> the article in the link you provided as it may apply to me as I am also in >> the minority as i am Deaf. So I face the same challenges as others who >> are in the minorities. **** >> >> **** >> >> Ashley Watson**** >> >> **** >> >> On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 4:24 PM, Jillian Shoblock <[log in to unmask]> >> wrote:**** >> >> I have been applying since December 2011 when I graduated with my MA in >> Museum Studies an have only had 2 interviews. Do I get frustrated a lot, >> yes but I haven't given up hope yet. I do still have an active social life >> and work in management in retail. Is that what I want? Definitely not. I >> intern at a museum that I love and would love to be able to work at. But >> can't afford to hire me so right now I am getting a little of what I love >> to do. What I have found is trying to stay positive even though I have >> applied to well over 100 positions all dealing with collections management >> and most with history, since that is one of my undergraduate degrees, is >> what keeps me going. Try to enjoy your life outside the museum an continue >> to visit museums. If you can't find a job in I e and have to work elsewhere >> then volunteer so you still get your fill. I know it sucks, trust me all my >> friends have full time jobs and are "living the life" but I have to believe >> that my time will come. Also my one friend keeps telling me to look at >> higher Ed jobs like academic advising if you have a masters. Just a >> thought. Good luck and keep your head up! >> >> Jillian >> >> Sent from my iPhone**** >> >> >> On Feb 20, 2013, at 3:58 PM, "Jentzsch, Tracy" <[log in to unmask]> >> wrote: >> >> > Ashley, for you and others searching for job leads, I would recommend a >> > free resource we offer through the University of Delaware's Museum >> Studies >> > Program. MuseWeekly is our weekly electronic news that provides job >> > posts, internships, conferences, calls for papers, announcements and >> news >> > related to all things "museum". We never rent or sell our list, and >> there >> > is always a plethora of good leads. You can sign up for this free >> > resource by going to our website, www.udel.edu/museumstudies and >> filing in >> > the three question form on the index page. Good luck to you. >> > >> > >> > >> > Tracy H. Jentzsch >> > Staff Assistant, Museum Studies Program >> > University of Delaware >> > 302.831.1251 >> > Www.udel.edu/museumstudies >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > On 2/20/13 3:49 PM, "Ashley Watson" <[log in to unmask]> wrote: >> > >> >> Hello, >> >> I graduated with masters in the museum studies at Syracuse University >> >> last May and have not found a job yet despite aggressively applying for >> >> various openings within my experience and skill range. I have completed >> >> an internship at National Museum of Natural History in the exhibits >> >> department and is currently a zooarchaeological/collections intern at >> the >> >> Museum Support Center till this May. Any recent graduates here that >> >> have the same frustrating experience? Those internships certainly >> help >> >> keep me sane professionally and personally but I certainly need to >> begin >> >> LIVING. I want to add one thing that I was more than qualified for one >> >> position at National Museum of Natural History but didn't break through >> >> the annoying human resources "wall". My colleague who was qualified to >> >> the maximum also applied for the same position got the same result. >> >> >> >> ========================================================= >> >> Important Subscriber Information: >> >> >> >> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at >> >> http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed >> >> information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail >> >> message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message >> should >> >> read "help" (without the quotes). >> >> >> >> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message >> to >> >> [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read >> >> "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). >> > >> > ========================================================= >> > Important Subscriber Information: >> >**** >> >> > The Museum-L FAQ file is located at >> http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed >> information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail >> message to [log in to unmask] .. The body of the message >> should read "help" (without the quotes).**** >> >> >> > >> > If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message >> to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read >> "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). >> >> ========================================================= >> Important Subscriber Information: >> >> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at >> http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed >> information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail >> message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should >> read "help" (without the quotes). >> >> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to >> [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read >> "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes).**** >> >> **** >> >> **** >> ------------------------------ >> >> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 **** >> >> **** >> >> **** >> ------------------------------ >> >> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 **** >> >> **** >> ------------------------------ >> >> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 **** >> >> ** ** >> ------------------------------ >> >> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 **** >> >> ** ** >> >> ** ** >> ------------------------------ >> >> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 **** >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 >> > > > ------------------------------ > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 > -- [log in to unmask] lindabnorris.com 607-829-3501 Treadwell, NY 13846 Like museums? Check out the Uncataloged Museum and the Museums and Creative Practiceproject Like food? Take a look at the Pickle Project ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). --bcaec555503e6118cb04d640691b Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I'll take a contrarian view at the moment.  How many museum studies programs disclose the full details about how many of their students find, within a reasonable amount of time, a real job, not an internship, part-time or short term work?  Is there any way to compare those statistics among programs?  Why does the field not ask for that? 

And,  as brought up in a conversation among colleagues at the Small Museum Association conference this week,  are museums complicit somehow in focusing on internships and contract positions, because it allows them to do more with less?   And if so,  how does gender play a role and how does the field (that's you and me) feel about it?

Linda

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:49 PM, Shana West <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

I can appreciate what you're saying, Jamie. But honestly, I wonder if it isn't more of a financial hardship on these grads to not have jobs than to spend a few hundred bucks on an interview. I mean, I wouldn't do it for the first interview. But at the second interview level (first via phone), they have a better sense of their chances and it could be a justifiable expense. Especially if they live in cities that are crowded with museum studies graduates--there might not be 10 but rather hundreds of local applicants for every job. But they also wouldn't want to just move to a new place without a job offer in hand just to become a local--especially to cities with fewer opportunities or high living expenses. They're caught between a rock and a hard place.

Cheers,

Shana

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:52 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

From the Museum perspective, I think a small to medium museum is not going to consider an out-of-State candidate if they are located more than a reasonable day trip away from the museum they apply to because the museum does not have the resources to reimburse each candidate for travel and they do realize that these candidates are just starting out and do not have the means to fly in for an interview for an entry level job either. That is why we keep our search State wide for entry level positions. Please keep in mind that we typically receive at least 50 resumes for such positions, all of which have basically the same level of education and experience and at least 10 of these candidates are fairly local, so there is no shortage of qualified local candidates. If we did advertise nationwide for such positions, I would really have a hard time as a human being asking a candidate to fly in knowing, at this stage in their career, it would cause them financial hardship when they are competing against so many other candidates with basically the same credentials. I would really concentrate my search locally, try and attain an entry level position and then take it from there. Certainly when you are ready to move on to a higher position, the search parameters widen and you can cast your net wider as well.

 

Jamie

 

From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Shana West
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 9:27 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

 

I have found it puzzling when museums I applied to in other states weren't interested because I wasn't local. I moved across the country for my first, entry-level museum job. Many graduates would jump at the chance for a full time job, regardless of location. So when grads have come to me asking for advice on applying out of state, I've told them to say they're already planning on moving to that city independently of the job (yes, it's a white lie). That way, the hiring museum won't feel like they have to pay expenses. 

 

I haven't tried it myself, but I was in a situation where I was actually moving to a new city and applying for a job. I don't think I would have been considered had I not already been planning a move. In fact, I'm pretty sure they asked me on the phone interview, "And you're definitely moving here?" 

 

Just an idea.

Shana

 

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:08 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Hi All:

I have posted positions on local sites before, such as MANY (Museum Association of the State of NY) and I have interviewed and hired candidates from these postings. Perhaps you need to look at State museum organizations rather than national organizations to post your resume on. I know from the Museum perspective, we are not interested in a nationwide search to fill an entry level position, so we keep the posting local, or at least at the State level.

 

Hope this helps and good luck,

Jamie Smith Quinn

Executive Director

FASNY Museum of Firefighting

 

From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Laurie A Sedicino
Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 11:08 PM

To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

 

I would also be interested in the answer to Matthew’s question.  I have to agree that - at least for museum field jobs – I have never once experienced museum search committees using posted resume sources…and I have never been contacted through these sources.  I would like to hear along with Matthew if you think these are good uses of such spare job search time and energy??

 

Thanks

Laurie

 

---

From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Matthew White
Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 4:52 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

 

I have a question for the group that is tangentially related.

 

There are several professional organizations that invite those looking for a job to post their resumes and particulars. (I have posted at both AAM and AASLH. I am sure there are similar sites in other niches of the field.) I have also posted on Linked-In. As anyone who has ever done this knows, it can be kind of time consuming to enter and keep current. 

 

Has anyone ever gotten contact through one of these services? An interview? A job?

 

For those of you who have hired recently, did you use these services? If not why not?

 

What about Linked-In?

 

Personally, I know a lot of people in the job market and even a good number who hire and I have never heard of ANYONE even being contacted through one of these services, let alone get a job.

 

Does anyone think these are good uses of spare job search time and energy?

 

Matthew White

On Feb 20, 2013, at 4:34 PM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

 

Hello all,  

   I want to thank you all for sharing your experiences and the advice.  I already decided to open my search wide open to start somewhere.   I had two job interviews that took the place last November but didn't get the job. I received a PERSONAL email from a museum to inform me that my professional package has been forwarded directly to the museum director.  So it certainly passed the human resources wall. So with that, should I check with them for the status progression?   

 

One more thing:

In response to Allison Bott,  despite my name giving an implication that I would be a female, I am actually a male. That is alright.  I will read the article in the link you provided as it may apply to me as I am also in the minority as i am Deaf.   So I face the same challenges as others who are in the minorities. 

 

Ashley Watson

 

On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 4:24 PM, Jillian Shoblock <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

I have been applying since December 2011 when I graduated with my MA in Museum Studies an have only had 2 interviews. Do I get frustrated a lot, yes but I haven't given up hope yet. I do still have an active social life and work in management in retail. Is that what I want? Definitely not. I intern at a museum that I love and would love to be able to work at. But can't afford to hire me so right now I am getting a little of what I love to do. What I have found is trying to stay positive even though I have applied to well over 100 positions all dealing with collections management and most with history, since that is one of my undergraduate degrees, is what keeps me going. Try to enjoy your life outside the museum an continue to visit museums. If you can't find a job in I e and have to work elsewhere then volunteer so you still get your fill. I know it sucks, trust me all my friends have full time jobs and are "living the life" but I have to believe that my time will come. Also my one friend keeps telling me to look at higher Ed jobs like academic advising if you have a masters. Just a thought. Good luck and keep your head up!

Jillian

Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 20, 2013, at 3:58 PM, "Jentzsch, Tracy" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> Ashley, for you and others searching for job leads, I would recommend a
> free resource we offer through the University of Delaware's Museum Studies
> Program.  MuseWeekly is our weekly electronic news that provides job
> posts, internships, conferences, calls for papers, announcements and news
> related to all things "museum".  We never rent or sell our list, and there
> is always a plethora of good leads.  You can sign up for this free
> resource by going to our website, www.udel.edu/museumstudies and filing in
> the three question form on the index page.  Good luck to you.
>
>
>
> Tracy H. Jentzsch
> Staff Assistant, Museum Studies Program
> University of Delaware
> 302.831.1251
> Www.udel.edu/museumstudies
>
>
>
>
>
> On 2/20/13 3:49 PM, "Ashley Watson" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>> Hello,
>>  I graduated with masters in the museum studies at Syracuse University
>> last May and have not found a job yet despite aggressively applying for
>> various openings within my experience and skill range. I have completed
>> an internship at National Museum of Natural History in the exhibits
>> department and is currently a zooarchaeological/collections intern at the
>> Museum Support Center till this May.   Any recent graduates here that
>> have the same frustrating experience?   Those internships certainly help
>> keep me sane professionally and personally but I certainly need to begin
>> LIVING. I want to add one thing that I was more than qualified for one
>> position at National Museum of Natural History but didn't break through
>> the annoying human resources "wall". My colleague who was qualified to
>> the maximum also applied for the same position got the same result.
>>
>> =========================================================
>> Important Subscriber Information:
>>
>> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at
>> http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed
>> information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail
>> message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should
>> read "help" (without the quotes).
>>
>> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to
>> [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read
>> "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes).
>
> =========================================================
> Important Subscriber Information:
>

> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] .. The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes).

>
> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes).

=========================================================
Important Subscriber Information:

The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes).

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--bcaec555503e6118cb04d640691b-- ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 13:41:24 -0500 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary¼aec54b4aa2f7bd3704d6406bc5 Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> --bcaec54b4aa2f7bd3704d6406bc5 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Shana, I totally understand the problems that arise in moving to a new place with no job offer in hand. I would not pursue it if I didn't have sources of other income to support me plus having a best friend to room with me. I agree that many feel caught between a rock and a hard place. At the same time, I understand what Jamie meant. Many museums are financially strapped to the point of making CERTAIN they choose the right individual with lowest possible expense(moving). So the museums could be in the same position as we are. Caught between a rock and a hard place. On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:49 PM, Shana West <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > I can appreciate what you're saying, Jamie. But honestly, I wonder if it > isn't more of a financial hardship on these grads to not have jobs than to > spend a few hundred bucks on an interview. I mean, I wouldn't do it for the > first interview. But at the second interview level (first via phone), they > have a better sense of their chances and it could be a justifiable expense. > Especially if they live in cities that are crowded with museum studies > graduates--there might not be 10 but rather hundreds of local applicants > for every job. But they also wouldn't want to just move to a new place > without a job offer in hand just to become a local--especially to cities > with fewer opportunities or high living expenses. They're caught between a > rock and a hard place. > Cheers, > Shana > > > On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:52 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]>wrote: > >> From the Museum perspective, I think a small to medium museum is not >> going to consider an out-of-State candidate if they are located more than a >> reasonable day trip away from the museum they apply to because the museum >> does not have the resources to reimburse each candidate for travel and they >> do realize that these candidates are just starting out and do not have the >> means to fly in for an interview for an entry level job either. That is why >> we keep our search State wide for entry level positions. Please keep in >> mind that we typically receive at least 50 resumes for such positions, all >> of which have basically the same level of education and experience and at >> least 10 of these candidates are fairly local, so there is no shortage of >> qualified local candidates. If we did advertise nationwide for such >> positions, I would really have a hard time as a human being asking a >> candidate to fly in knowing, at this stage in their career, it would cause >> them financial hardship when they are competing against so many other >> candidates with basically the same credentials. I would really concentrate >> my search locally, try and attain an entry level position and then take it >> from there. Certainly when you are ready to move on to a higher position, >> the search parameters widen and you can cast your net wider as well.**** >> >> ** ** >> >> Jamie**** >> >> ** ** >> >> *From:* Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] *On >> Behalf Of *Shana West >> *Sent:* Thursday, February 21, 2013 9:27 AM >> *To:* [log in to unmask] >> *Subject:* SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for >> the recent graduates**** >> >> ** ** >> >> I have found it puzzling when museums I applied to in other states >> weren't interested because I wasn't local. I moved across the country for >> my first, entry-level museum job. Many graduates would jump at the chance >> for a full time job, regardless of location. So when grads have come to me >> asking for advice on applying out of state, I've told them to say they're >> already planning on moving to that city independently of the job (yes, it's >> a white lie). That way, the hiring museum won't feel like they have to pay >> expenses. **** >> >> ** ** >> >> I haven't tried it myself, but I was in a situation where I was actually >> moving to a new city and applying for a job. I don't think I would have >> been considered had I not already been planning a move. In fact, I'm pretty >> sure they asked me on the phone interview, "And you're definitely moving >> here?" **** >> >> ** ** >> >> Just an idea.**** >> >> Shana**** >> >> ** ** >> >> On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:08 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]> >> wrote:**** >> >> Hi All:**** >> >> I have posted positions on local sites before, such as MANY (Museum >> Association of the State of NY) and I have interviewed and hired candidates >> from these postings. Perhaps you need to look at State museum organizations >> rather than national organizations to post your resume on. I know from the >> Museum perspective, we are not interested in a nationwide search to fill an >> entry level position, so we keep the posting local, or at least at the >> State level.**** >> >> **** >> >> Hope this helps and good luck,**** >> >> Jamie Smith Quinn**** >> >> Executive Director**** >> >> FASNY Museum of Firefighting**** >> >> **** >> >> *From:* Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] *On >> Behalf Of *Laurie A Sedicino >> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 20, 2013 11:08 PM**** >> >> >> *To:* [log in to unmask] >> *Subject:* Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent >> graduates**** >> >> **** >> >> I would also be interested in the answer to Matthew’s question. I have >> to agree that - at least for museum field jobs – I have never once >> experienced museum search committees using posted resume sources…and I have >> never been contacted through these sources. I would like to hear along >> with Matthew if you think these are good uses of *such *spare job search >> time and energy??**** >> >> **** >> >> Thanks**** >> >> Laurie**** >> >> **** >> ------------------------------ >> >> *From:* Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]<[log in to unmask]>] >> *On Behalf Of *Matthew White >> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 20, 2013 4:52 PM >> *To:* [log in to unmask] >> *Subject:* Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent >> graduates**** >> >> **** >> >> I have a question for the group that is tangentially related.**** >> >> **** >> >> There are several professional organizations that invite those looking >> for a job to post their resumes and particulars. (I have posted at both AAM >> and AASLH. I am sure there are similar sites in other niches of the field.) >> I have also posted on Linked-In. As anyone who has ever done this knows, it >> can be kind of time consuming to enter and keep current. **** >> >> **** >> >> Has anyone ever gotten contact through one of these services? An >> interview? A job?**** >> >> **** >> >> For those of you who have hired recently, did you use these services? If >> not why not?**** >> >> **** >> >> What about Linked-In?**** >> >> **** >> >> Personally, I know a lot of people in the job market and even a good >> number who hire and I have never heard of ANYONE even being contacted >> through one of these services, let alone get a job.**** >> >> **** >> >> Does anyone think these are good uses of spare job search time and energy? >> **** >> >> **** >> >> Matthew White**** >> >> On Feb 20, 2013, at 4:34 PM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote:**** >> >> **** >> >> Hello all, **** >> >> I want to thank you all for sharing your experiences and the advice. >> I already decided to open my search wide open to start somewhere. I had >> two job interviews that took the place last November but didn't get the >> job. I received a PERSONAL email from a museum to inform me that my >> professional package has been forwarded directly to the museum director. >> So it certainly passed the human resources wall. So with that, should I >> check with them for the status progression? **** >> >> **** >> >> One more thing:**** >> >> In response to Allison Bott, despite my name giving an implication that >> I would be a female, I am actually a male. That is alright. I will read >> the article in the link you provided as it may apply to me as I am also in >> the minority as i am Deaf. So I face the same challenges as others who >> are in the minorities. **** >> >> **** >> >> Ashley Watson**** >> >> **** >> >> On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 4:24 PM, Jillian Shoblock <[log in to unmask]> >> wrote:**** >> >> I have been applying since December 2011 when I graduated with my MA in >> Museum Studies an have only had 2 interviews. Do I get frustrated a lot, >> yes but I haven't given up hope yet. I do still have an active social life >> and work in management in retail. Is that what I want? Definitely not. I >> intern at a museum that I love and would love to be able to work at. But >> can't afford to hire me so right now I am getting a little of what I love >> to do. What I have found is trying to stay positive even though I have >> applied to well over 100 positions all dealing with collections management >> and most with history, since that is one of my undergraduate degrees, is >> what keeps me going. Try to enjoy your life outside the museum an continue >> to visit museums. If you can't find a job in I e and have to work elsewhere >> then volunteer so you still get your fill. I know it sucks, trust me all my >> friends have full time jobs and are "living the life" but I have to believe >> that my time will come. Also my one friend keeps telling me to look at >> higher Ed jobs like academic advising if you have a masters. Just a >> thought. Good luck and keep your head up! >> >> Jillian >> >> Sent from my iPhone**** >> >> >> On Feb 20, 2013, at 3:58 PM, "Jentzsch, Tracy" <[log in to unmask]> >> wrote: >> >> > Ashley, for you and others searching for job leads, I would recommend a >> > free resource we offer through the University of Delaware's Museum >> Studies >> > Program. MuseWeekly is our weekly electronic news that provides job >> > posts, internships, conferences, calls for papers, announcements and >> news >> > related to all things "museum". We never rent or sell our list, and >> there >> > is always a plethora of good leads. You can sign up for this free >> > resource by going to our website, www.udel.edu/museumstudies and >> filing in >> > the three question form on the index page. Good luck to you. >> > >> > >> > >> > Tracy H. Jentzsch >> > Staff Assistant, Museum Studies Program >> > University of Delaware >> > 302.831.1251 >> > Www.udel.edu/museumstudies >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > On 2/20/13 3:49 PM, "Ashley Watson" <[log in to unmask]> wrote: >> > >> >> Hello, >> >> I graduated with masters in the museum studies at Syracuse University >> >> last May and have not found a job yet despite aggressively applying for >> >> various openings within my experience and skill range. I have completed >> >> an internship at National Museum of Natural History in the exhibits >> >> department and is currently a zooarchaeological/collections intern at >> the >> >> Museum Support Center till this May. Any recent graduates here that >> >> have the same frustrating experience? Those internships certainly >> help >> >> keep me sane professionally and personally but I certainly need to >> begin >> >> LIVING. I want to add one thing that I was more than qualified for one >> >> position at National Museum of Natural History but didn't break through >> >> the annoying human resources "wall". My colleague who was qualified to >> >> the maximum also applied for the same position got the same result. >> >> >> >> ========================================================= >> >> Important Subscriber Information: >> >> >> >> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at >> >> http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed >> >> information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail >> >> message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message >> should >> >> read "help" (without the quotes). >> >> >> >> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message >> to >> >> [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read >> >> "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). >> > >> > ========================================================= >> > Important Subscriber Information: >> >**** >> >> > The Museum-L FAQ file is located at >> http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed >> information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail >> message to [log in to unmask] .. The body of the message >> should read "help" (without the quotes).**** >> >> >> > >> > If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message >> to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read >> "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). >> >> ========================================================= >> Important Subscriber Information: >> >> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at >> http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed >> information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail >> message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should >> read "help" (without the quotes). >> >> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to >> [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read >> "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes).**** >> >> **** >> >> **** >> ------------------------------ >> >> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 **** >> >> **** >> >> **** >> ------------------------------ >> >> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 **** >> >> **** >> ------------------------------ >> >> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 **** >> >> ** ** >> ------------------------------ >> >> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 **** >> >> ** ** >> >> ** ** >> ------------------------------ >> >> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 **** >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 >> > > > ------------------------------ > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 > ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). --bcaec54b4aa2f7bd3704d6406bc5 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Shana,

  I totally understand the problems that arise in moving to a new place with no job offer in hand.   I would not pursue it if I didn't have sources of other income to support me plus having a best friend to room with me.   I agree that many feel caught between a rock and a hard place.  At the same time, I understand what Jamie meant.  Many museums are financially strapped to the point of making CERTAIN they choose the right individual with lowest possible expense(moving).  So the museums could be in the same position as we are. Caught between a rock and a hard place.    

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:49 PM, Shana West <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

I can appreciate what you're saying, Jamie. But honestly, I wonder if it isn't more of a financial hardship on these grads to not have jobs than to spend a few hundred bucks on an interview. I mean, I wouldn't do it for the first interview. But at the second interview level (first via phone), they have a better sense of their chances and it could be a justifiable expense. Especially if they live in cities that are crowded with museum studies graduates--there might not be 10 but rather hundreds of local applicants for every job. But they also wouldn't want to just move to a new place without a job offer in hand just to become a local--especially to cities with fewer opportunities or high living expenses. They're caught between a rock and a hard place.

Cheers,

Shana

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:52 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

From the Museum perspective, I think a small to medium museum is not going to consider an out-of-State candidate if they are located more than a reasonable day trip away from the museum they apply to because the museum does not have the resources to reimburse each candidate for travel and they do realize that these candidates are just starting out and do not have the means to fly in for an interview for an entry level job either. That is why we keep our search State wide for entry level positions. Please keep in mind that we typically receive at least 50 resumes for such positions, all of which have basically the same level of education and experience and at least 10 of these candidates are fairly local, so there is no shortage of qualified local candidates. If we did advertise nationwide for such positions, I would really have a hard time as a human being asking a candidate to fly in knowing, at this stage in their career, it would cause them financial hardship when they are competing against so many other candidates with basically the same credentials. I would really concentrate my search locally, try and attain an entry level position and then take it from there. Certainly when you are ready to move on to a higher position, the search parameters widen and you can cast your net wider as well.

 

Jamie

 

From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Shana West
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 9:27 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

 

I have found it puzzling when museums I applied to in other states weren't interested because I wasn't local. I moved across the country for my first, entry-level museum job. Many graduates would jump at the chance for a full time job, regardless of location. So when grads have come to me asking for advice on applying out of state, I've told them to say they're already planning on moving to that city independently of the job (yes, it's a white lie). That way, the hiring museum won't feel like they have to pay expenses. 

 

I haven't tried it myself, but I was in a situation where I was actually moving to a new city and applying for a job. I don't think I would have been considered had I not already been planning a move. In fact, I'm pretty sure they asked me on the phone interview, "And you're definitely moving here?" 

 

Just an idea.

Shana

 

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:08 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Hi All:

I have posted positions on local sites before, such as MANY (Museum Association of the State of NY) and I have interviewed and hired candidates from these postings. Perhaps you need to look at State museum organizations rather than national organizations to post your resume on. I know from the Museum perspective, we are not interested in a nationwide search to fill an entry level position, so we keep the posting local, or at least at the State level.

 

Hope this helps and good luck,

Jamie Smith Quinn

Executive Director

FASNY Museum of Firefighting

 

From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Laurie A Sedicino
Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 11:08 PM

To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

 

I would also be interested in the answer to Matthew’s question.  I have to agree that - at least for museum field jobs – I have never once experienced museum search committees using posted resume sources…and I have never been contacted through these sources.  I would like to hear along with Matthew if you think these are good uses of such spare job search time and energy??

 

Thanks

Laurie

 

---

From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Matthew White
Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 4:52 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

 

I have a question for the group that is tangentially related.

 

There are several professional organizations that invite those looking for a job to post their resumes and particulars. (I have posted at both AAM and AASLH. I am sure there are similar sites in other niches of the field.) I have also posted on Linked-In. As anyone who has ever done this knows, it can be kind of time consuming to enter and keep current. 

 

Has anyone ever gotten contact through one of these services? An interview? A job?

 

For those of you who have hired recently, did you use these services? If not why not?

 

What about Linked-In?

 

Personally, I know a lot of people in the job market and even a good number who hire and I have never heard of ANYONE even being contacted through one of these services, let alone get a job.

 

Does anyone think these are good uses of spare job search time and energy?

 

Matthew White

On Feb 20, 2013, at 4:34 PM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

 

Hello all,  

   I want to thank you all for sharing your experiences and the advice.  I already decided to open my search wide open to start somewhere.   I had two job interviews that took the place last November but didn't get the job. I received a PERSONAL email from a museum to inform me that my professional package has been forwarded directly to the museum director.  So it certainly passed the human resources wall. So with that, should I check with them for the status progression?   

 

One more thing:

In response to Allison Bott,  despite my name giving an implication that I would be a female, I am actually a male. That is alright.  I will read the article in the link you provided as it may apply to me as I am also in the minority as i am Deaf.   So I face the same challenges as others who are in the minorities. 

 

Ashley Watson

 

On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 4:24 PM, Jillian Shoblock <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

I have been applying since December 2011 when I graduated with my MA in Museum Studies an have only had 2 interviews. Do I get frustrated a lot, yes but I haven't given up hope yet. I do still have an active social life and work in management in retail. Is that what I want? Definitely not. I intern at a museum that I love and would love to be able to work at. But can't afford to hire me so right now I am getting a little of what I love to do. What I have found is trying to stay positive even though I have applied to well over 100 positions all dealing with collections management and most with history, since that is one of my undergraduate degrees, is what keeps me going. Try to enjoy your life outside the museum an continue to visit museums. If you can't find a job in I e and have to work elsewhere then volunteer so you still get your fill. I know it sucks, trust me all my friends have full time jobs and are "living the life" but I have to believe that my time will come. Also my one friend keeps telling me to look at higher Ed jobs like academic advising if you have a masters. Just a thought. Good luck and keep your head up!

Jillian

Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 20, 2013, at 3:58 PM, "Jentzsch, Tracy" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> Ashley, for you and others searching for job leads, I would recommend a
> free resource we offer through the University of Delaware's Museum Studies
> Program.  MuseWeekly is our weekly electronic news that provides job
> posts, internships, conferences, calls for papers, announcements and news
> related to all things "museum".  We never rent or sell our list, and there
> is always a plethora of good leads.  You can sign up for this free
> resource by going to our website, www.udel.edu/museumstudies and filing in
> the three question form on the index page.  Good luck to you.
>
>
>
> Tracy H. Jentzsch
> Staff Assistant, Museum Studies Program
> University of Delaware
> 302.831.1251
> Www.udel.edu/museumstudies
>
>
>
>
>
> On 2/20/13 3:49 PM, "Ashley Watson" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>> Hello,
>>  I graduated with masters in the museum studies at Syracuse University
>> last May and have not found a job yet despite aggressively applying for
>> various openings within my experience and skill range. I have completed
>> an internship at National Museum of Natural History in the exhibits
>> department and is currently a zooarchaeological/collections intern at the
>> Museum Support Center till this May.   Any recent graduates here that
>> have the same frustrating experience?   Those internships certainly help
>> keep me sane professionally and personally but I certainly need to begin
>> LIVING. I want to add one thing that I was more than qualified for one
>> position at National Museum of Natural History but didn't break through
>> the annoying human resources "wall". My colleague who was qualified to
>> the maximum also applied for the same position got the same result.
>>
>> =========================================================
>> Important Subscriber Information:
>>
>> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at
>> http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed
>> information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail
>> message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should
>> read "help" (without the quotes).
>>
>> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to
>> [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read
>> "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes).
>
> =========================================================
> Important Subscriber Information:
>

> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] .. The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes).

>
> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes).

=========================================================
Important Subscriber Information:

The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes).

If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes).

 

 

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--bcaec54b4aa2f7bd3704d6406bc5-- ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 08:27:32 -0500 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: "Robin Gabriel (home)" <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates In-Reply-To: <249A7A8BE6FF47ECBFA0BDA38A2DF214@userc9e67dd9a4> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-D5DD7892-2057-4EE5-AD19-30E40793C50C Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> --Apple-Mail-D5DD7892-2057-4EE5-AD19-30E40793C50C Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Matthew and Laurie, Personally (not speaking for my current or former employers), I have never looked at those data bases of resumes when I've been in a position to hire. There was no reason to since I had a good selection of resumes sent to me by traditional means. That being said, I do think having a LinkedIn profile is a good thing. It not only allows you to build your network and stay in touch with former coworkers/classmates, but it is also used by head hunters when they are doing their searches. Or at least I'm guessing they use it a lot based upon the emails I've gotten over the years. For those of you frustrated by the current job market, I wish you nothing but good luck and good thoughts. Finding a first or second job in the museum field has never been easy - even when I was first looking several decades ago. Salaries have always been low and most of us (myself included) had to have more than one job to makes ends meet. If its any consolation, I predict a lot of jobs opening in the next five to ten years as the baby boomers retire. I agree with all of the advice given out already and I personally would push anyone looking to set up some informational interviews. They are a great way to get your foot in the door and you may even find a good mentor out of the experience. Good luck Robin Gabriel On Feb 20, 2013, at 11:08 PM, Laurie A Sedicino <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > I would also be interested in the answer to Matthew’s question. I have to agree that - at least for museum field jobs – I have never once experienced museum search committees using posted resume sources…and I have never been contacted through these sources. I would like to hear along with Matthew if you think these are good uses of such spare job search time and energy?? > > Thanks > Laurie > > From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Matthew White > Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 4:52 PM > To: [log in to unmask] > Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates > > I have a question for the group that is tangentially related. > > There are several professional organizations that invite those looking for a job to post their resumes and particulars. (I have posted at both AAM and AASLH. I am sure there are similar sites in other niches of the field.) I have also posted on Linked-In. As anyone who has ever done this knows, it can be kind of time consuming to enter and keep current. > > Has anyone ever gotten contact through one of these services? An interview? A job? > > For those of you who have hired recently, did you use these services? If not why not? > > What about Linked-In? > > Personally, I know a lot of people in the job market and even a good number who hire and I have never heard of ANYONE even being contacted through one of these services, let alone get a job. > > Does anyone think these are good uses of spare job search time and energy? > > Matthew White > ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). --Apple-Mail-D5DD7892-2057-4EE5-AD19-30E40793C50C Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Matthew and Laurie,

Personally (not speaking for my current or former employers), I have never looked at those data bases of resumes when I've been in a position to hire. There was no reason to since I had a good selection of resumes sent to me by traditional means. 

That being said, I do think having a LinkedIn profile is a good thing. It not only allows you to build your network and stay in touch with former coworkers/classmates, but it is also used by head hunters when they are doing their searches. Or at least I'm guessing they use it a lot based upon the emails I've gotten over the years. 

For those of you frustrated by the current job market, I wish you nothing but good luck and good thoughts. Finding a first or second job in the museum field has never been easy - even when I was first looking several decades ago. Salaries have always been low and most of us (myself included) had to have more than one job to makes ends meet. If its any consolation, I predict a lot of jobs opening in the next five to ten years as the baby boomers retire. 

I agree with all of the advice given out already and I personally would push anyone looking to set up some informational interviews. They are a great way to get your foot in the door and you may even find a good mentor out of the experience. 

Good luck

Robin Gabriel

On Feb 20, 2013, at 11:08 PM, Laurie A Sedicino <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

I would also be interested in the answer to Matthew’s question.  I have to agree that - at least for museum field jobs – I have never once experienced museum search committees using posted resume sources…and I have never been contacted through these sources.  I would like to hear along with Matthew if you think these are good uses of such spare job search time and energy??

 

Thanks

Laurie

 

---

From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Matthew White
Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 4:52 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

 

I have a question for the group that is tangentially related.

 

There are several professional organizations that invite those looking for a job to post their resumes and particulars. (I have posted at both AAM and AASLH. I am sure there are similar sites in other niches of the field.) I have also posted on Linked-In. As anyone who has ever done this knows, it can be kind of time consuming to enter and keep current. 

 

Has anyone ever gotten contact through one of these services? An interview? A job?

 

For those of you who have hired recently, did you use these services? If not why not?

 

What about Linked-In?

 

Personally, I know a lot of people in the job market and even a good number who hire and I have never heard of ANYONE even being contacted through one of these services, let alone get a job.

 

Does anyone think these are good uses of spare job search time and energy?

 

Matthew White

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--Apple-Mail-D5DD7892-2057-4EE5-AD19-30E40793C50C-- ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 13:03:06 -0600 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Rachel Smith <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> Some Museum Studies programs do gather/provide information on how many students have found full time or part time work, but not whether that work is in a museum or outside the field! Rachel Smith [log in to unmask] On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:40 PM, Linda Norris <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > I'll take a contrarian view at the moment. How many museum studies programs > disclose the full details about how many of their students find, within a > reasonable amount of time, a real job, not an internship, part-time or short > term work? Is there any way to compare those statistics among programs? > Why does the field not ask for that? > > And, as brought up in a conversation among colleagues at the Small Museum > Association conference this week, are museums complicit somehow in focusing > on internships and contract positions, because it allows them to do more > with less? And if so, how does gender play a role and how does the field > (that's you and me) feel about it? > > Linda > > > On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 12:49 PM, Shana West <[log in to unmask]> wrote: >> >> I can appreciate what you're saying, Jamie. But honestly, I wonder if it >> isn't more of a financial hardship on these grads to not have jobs than to >> spend a few hundred bucks on an interview. I mean, I wouldn't do it for the >> first interview. But at the second interview level (first via phone), they >> have a better sense of their chances and it could be a justifiable expense. >> Especially if they live in cities that are crowded with museum studies >> graduates--there might not be 10 but rather hundreds of local applicants for >> every job. But they also wouldn't want to just move to a new place without a >> job offer in hand just to become a local--especially to cities with fewer >> opportunities or high living expenses. They're caught between a rock and a >> hard place. >> Cheers, >> Shana >> >> >> On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:52 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]> >> wrote: >>> >>> From the Museum perspective, I think a small to medium museum is not >>> going to consider an out-of-State candidate if they are located more than a >>> reasonable day trip away from the museum they apply to because the museum >>> does not have the resources to reimburse each candidate for travel and they >>> do realize that these candidates are just starting out and do not have the >>> means to fly in for an interview for an entry level job either. That is why >>> we keep our search State wide for entry level positions. Please keep in mind >>> that we typically receive at least 50 resumes for such positions, all of >>> which have basically the same level of education and experience and at least >>> 10 of these candidates are fairly local, so there is no shortage of >>> qualified local candidates. If we did advertise nationwide for such >>> positions, I would really have a hard time as a human being asking a >>> candidate to fly in knowing, at this stage in their career, it would cause >>> them financial hardship when they are competing against so many other >>> candidates with basically the same credentials. I would really concentrate >>> my search locally, try and attain an entry level position and then take it >>> from there. Certainly when you are ready to move on to a higher position, >>> the search parameters widen and you can cast your net wider as well. >>> >>> >>> >>> Jamie >>> >>> >>> >>> From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On >>> Behalf Of Shana West >>> Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 9:27 AM >>> To: [log in to unmask] >>> Subject: SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the >>> recent graduates >>> >>> >>> >>> I have found it puzzling when museums I applied to in other states >>> weren't interested because I wasn't local. I moved across the country for my >>> first, entry-level museum job. Many graduates would jump at the chance for a >>> full time job, regardless of location. So when grads have come to me asking >>> for advice on applying out of state, I've told them to say they're already >>> planning on moving to that city independently of the job (yes, it's a white >>> lie). That way, the hiring museum won't feel like they have to pay expenses. >>> >>> >>> >>> I haven't tried it myself, but I was in a situation where I was actually >>> moving to a new city and applying for a job. I don't think I would have been >>> considered had I not already been planning a move. In fact, I'm pretty sure >>> they asked me on the phone interview, "And you're definitely moving here?" >>> >>> >>> >>> Just an idea. >>> >>> Shana >>> >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:08 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]> >>> wrote: >>> >>> Hi All: >>> >>> I have posted positions on local sites before, such as MANY (Museum >>> Association of the State of NY) and I have interviewed and hired candidates >>> from these postings. Perhaps you need to look at State museum organizations >>> rather than national organizations to post your resume on. I know from the >>> Museum perspective, we are not interested in a nationwide search to fill an >>> entry level position, so we keep the posting local, or at least at the State >>> level. >>> >>> >>> >>> Hope this helps and good luck, >>> >>> Jamie Smith Quinn >>> >>> Executive Director >>> >>> FASNY Museum of Firefighting >>> >>> >>> >>> From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On >>> Behalf Of Laurie A Sedicino >>> Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 11:08 PM >>> >>> >>> To: [log in to unmask] >>> Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent >>> graduates >>> >>> >>> >>> I would also be interested in the answer to Matthew’s question. I have >>> to agree that - at least for museum field jobs – I have never once >>> experienced museum search committees using posted resume sources…and I have >>> never been contacted through these sources. I would like to hear along with >>> Matthew if you think these are good uses of such spare job search time and >>> energy?? >>> >>> >>> >>> Thanks >>> >>> Laurie >>> >>> >>> >>> ________________________________ >>> >>> From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On >>> Behalf Of Matthew White >>> Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 4:52 PM >>> To: [log in to unmask] >>> Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent >>> graduates >>> >>> >>> >>> I have a question for the group that is tangentially related. >>> >>> >>> >>> There are several professional organizations that invite those looking >>> for a job to post their resumes and particulars. (I have posted at both AAM >>> and AASLH. I am sure there are similar sites in other niches of the field.) >>> I have also posted on Linked-In. As anyone who has ever done this knows, it >>> can be kind of time consuming to enter and keep current. >>> >>> >>> >>> Has anyone ever gotten contact through one of these services? An >>> interview? A job? >>> >>> >>> >>> For those of you who have hired recently, did you use these services? If >>> not why not? >>> >>> >>> >>> What about Linked-In? >>> >>> >>> >>> Personally, I know a lot of people in the job market and even a good >>> number who hire and I have never heard of ANYONE even being contacted >>> through one of these services, let alone get a job. >>> >>> >>> >>> Does anyone think these are good uses of spare job search time and >>> energy? >>> >>> >>> >>> Matthew White >>> >>> On Feb 20, 2013, at 4:34 PM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> Hello all, >>> >>> I want to thank you all for sharing your experiences and the advice. >>> I already decided to open my search wide open to start somewhere. I had >>> two job interviews that took the place last November but didn't get the job. >>> I received a PERSONAL email from a museum to inform me that my professional >>> package has been forwarded directly to the museum director. So it certainly >>> passed the human resources wall. So with that, should I check with them for >>> the status progression? >>> >>> >>> >>> One more thing: >>> >>> In response to Allison Bott, despite my name giving an implication that >>> I would be a female, I am actually a male. That is alright. I will read the >>> article in the link you provided as it may apply to me as I am also in the >>> minority as i am Deaf. So I face the same challenges as others who are in >>> the minorities. >>> >>> >>> >>> Ashley Watson >>> >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 4:24 PM, Jillian Shoblock <[log in to unmask]> >>> wrote: >>> >>> I have been applying since December 2011 when I graduated with my MA in >>> Museum Studies an have only had 2 interviews. Do I get frustrated a lot, yes >>> but I haven't given up hope yet. I do still have an active social life and >>> work in management in retail. Is that what I want? Definitely not. I intern >>> at a museum that I love and would love to be able to work at. But can't >>> afford to hire me so right now I am getting a little of what I love to do. >>> What I have found is trying to stay positive even though I have applied to >>> well over 100 positions all dealing with collections management and most >>> with history, since that is one of my undergraduate degrees, is what keeps >>> me going. Try to enjoy your life outside the museum an continue to visit >>> museums. If you can't find a job in I e and have to work elsewhere then >>> volunteer so you still get your fill. I know it sucks, trust me all my >>> friends have full time jobs and are "living the life" but I have to believe >>> that my time will come. Also my one friend keeps telling me to look at >>> higher Ed jobs like academic advising if you have a masters. Just a thought. >>> Good luck and keep your head up! >>> >>> Jillian >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> >>> On Feb 20, 2013, at 3:58 PM, "Jentzsch, Tracy" >>> <[log in to unmask]> wrote: >>> >>> > Ashley, for you and others searching for job leads, I would recommend a >>> > free resource we offer through the University of Delaware's Museum >>> > Studies >>> > Program. MuseWeekly is our weekly electronic news that provides job >>> > posts, internships, conferences, calls for papers, announcements and >>> > news >>> > related to all things "museum". We never rent or sell our list, and >>> > there >>> > is always a plethora of good leads. You can sign up for this free >>> > resource by going to our website, www.udel.edu/museumstudies and filing >>> > in >>> > the three question form on the index page. Good luck to you. >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > Tracy H. Jentzsch >>> > Staff Assistant, Museum Studies Program >>> > University of Delaware >>> > 302.831.1251 >>> > Www.udel.edu/museumstudies >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > On 2/20/13 3:49 PM, "Ashley Watson" <[log in to unmask]> wrote: >>> > >>> >> Hello, >>> >> I graduated with masters in the museum studies at Syracuse University >>> >> last May and have not found a job yet despite aggressively applying >>> >> for >>> >> various openings within my experience and skill range. I have >>> >> completed >>> >> an internship at National Museum of Natural History in the exhibits >>> >> department and is currently a zooarchaeological/collections intern at >>> >> the >>> >> Museum Support Center till this May. Any recent graduates here that >>> >> have the same frustrating experience? Those internships certainly >>> >> help >>> >> keep me sane professionally and personally but I certainly need to >>> >> begin >>> >> LIVING. I want to add one thing that I was more than qualified for one >>> >> position at National Museum of Natural History but didn't break >>> >> through >>> >> the annoying human resources "wall". My colleague who was qualified to >>> >> the maximum also applied for the same position got the same result. >>> >> >>> >> ========================================================= >>> >> Important Subscriber Information: >>> >> >>> >> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at >>> >> http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed >>> >> information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail >>> >> message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message >>> >> should >>> >> read "help" (without the quotes). >>> >> >>> >> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message >>> >> to >>> >> [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read >>> >> "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). >>> > >>> > ========================================================= >>> > Important Subscriber Information: >>> > >>> >>> > The Museum-L FAQ file is located at >>> > http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed >>> > information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message >>> > to [log in to unmask] .. The body of the message should read >>> > "help" (without the quotes). >>> >>> >>> > >>> > If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message >>> > to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read >>> > "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). >>> >>> ========================================================= >>> Important Subscriber Information: >>> >>> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at >>> http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed >>> information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message >>> to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" >>> (without the quotes). >>> >>> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to >>> [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff >>> Museum-L" (without the quotes). >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ________________________________ >>> >>> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >>> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ________________________________ >>> >>> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >>> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 >>> >>> >>> >>> ________________________________ >>> >>> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >>> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 >>> >>> >>> >>> ________________________________ >>> >>> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >>> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ________________________________ >>> >>> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >>> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 >>> >>> >>> ________________________________ >>> >>> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >>> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 >> >> >> >> ________________________________ >> >> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 > > > > > -- > [log in to unmask] > lindabnorris.com > 607-829-3501 Treadwell, NY 13846 > > Like museums? Check out the Uncataloged Museum > and the Museums and Creative Practice project > Like food? Take a look at the Pickle Project > > > ________________________________ > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 15:38:32 +0000 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Christina Nichols <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Copyright Webinar - Webinaire sur le droit d=?windows-1256?Q?’auteur?Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_EF1297F26DCAEB42A665D2AE78D86DDB01243CDACCASVR01ccaloca_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> --_000_EF1297F26DCAEB42A665D2AE78D86DDB01243CDACCASVR01ccaloca_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1256" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Please excuse cross postings. This may be of interest to list members. For members of the heritage communities: archives, libraries, museums and heritage sites Join us on February 26th or March 27th 2013 for a Copyright Webinar The copyright landscape has changed and it affects those of us in heritage institutions who serve researchers. As part of its continuing mandate to improve access to and understanding of Canada’s archival heritage, the Canadian Council of Archives (CCA) developed a webinar to inform the archival community about changes to Canada’s new copyright legislation, and we are pleased to offer it to all members of the heritages communities whether they be archives, libraries, museums or heritage sites. What does your staff need to know? Feedback has been overwhelmingly positive for this timely and informative session. Staff from over 100 memory institutions have already participated! Tap into the knowledge of session lead Nancy Marrelli, Senior Advisor on Copyright to the CCA Board of Directors. Nancy has closely followed copyright legislation and spearheaded copyright advocacy for the Canadian archival community for many years. How does the new legislation affect your reference services, your digitization programs? Your donors? Your preservation program? Please join us to learn more about Bill C-11 and its implementation. Spend an interactive 90 minutes with us and learn about how the new amendments will affect your institution and your users. Cost: Registration is $155 plus GST Sessions: February 26th (12:00 to 13:30 EST) March 27th (13:00 to 14:30 EDT) Registration is limited and advance registration will be required. Participants require a telephone and a computer with an Internet connection to fully participate in the Copyright Webinars. To register, please complete the attached form at http://www.cdncouncilarchives.ca/webinars.html and return it to CCA at your earliest opportunity! Note: Sessions are available in English only at this time. French sessions may be scheduled if sufficient demand is expressed. If you would prefer to attend a French session, please indicate your preference via email to [log in to unmask]. *_*_*_* Pour les membres des communautés vouées au patrimoine: archives, bibliothèques, musées et sites historiques Joignez-vous à nous le 26 février ou le 27 mars 2013 pour un webinaire sur le droit d’auteur Le monde du droit d’auteur a changé pour nous tous qui sont impliqués dans les organismes voués au patrimoine qui servent les chercheurs. Dans le cadre de son mandat qui vise à améliorer l’accès au patrimoine archivistique canadien et à en approfondir sa connaissance, le Conseil canadien des archives (CCA) a développé un webinaire sur les amendements à la loi sur le droit d’auteur et nous sommes heureux de l’offrir aux membres des communautés vouées au patrimoine soit les services d’archives, les bibliothèques, les musées ou sites historiques. Qu’est-ce que vos employés doivent connaitre? Les commentaires reçus ont été extrêmement positifs pour ce webinaire informatif et opportun. Des employés d’un peu plus de 100 organismes ont déjà participé! Prenez avantage des connaissances de la responsable de la session Nancy Marrelli, Conseillère sur le droit d’auteur auprès du Comité de direction du CCA. Nancy suit de près l’évolution de la loi sur le droit d’auteur et elle mène les activités de sensibilisation au sujet du droit d’auteur au nom de la communauté archivistique canadienne depuis de nombreuses années. Quels seront les effets de la nouvelle loi sur votre service de référence, vos projets de numérisation? Vos donateurs? Votre programme de préservation? Joignez-vous à nous afin d’en apprendre d’avantage à propos de la loi C-11 et de sa mise en œuvre. Passez un 90 minutes interactif avec nous et apprenez les effets que les amendements à la loi pourraient avoir sur votre institution et vos usagers. Frais : Les frais d’inscription sont de 155$ plus TPS Sessions : Le 26 février (12h à 13 :30 HNE) Le 27 mars (13h à 14h30 HAE) Le nombre d’inscription est limité et l’inscription avant les sessions est requise. Les participants auront besoin d’un téléphone ainsi que d’une connexion Internet afin de pouvoir participer pleinement au webinaire. Veuillez compléter le formulaire d’inscription http://www.cdncouncilarchives.ca/f-webinars.html et le retourner au CCA le plus tôt possible! Note : Ces deux sessions sont offertes uniquement en anglais. Cependant, des sessions de langue française pourraient être ajoutées au calendrier si nous recevons une demande suffisante pour celles-ci. Si vous préfèreriez participer à une session en français, veuillez nous l’indiquer par courriel à l’adresse suivante : [log in to unmask]. Canadian Council of Archives Conseil canadien des archives 130 Albert St. 130, rue Albert Suite 1201 bureau 1201 Ottawa, ON K1P 5G4 Ottawa, ON K1P 5G4 ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). --_000_EF1297F26DCAEB42A665D2AE78D86DDB01243CDACCASVR01ccaloca_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1256" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Please excuse cross postings. This may be of interest to list members.

 

For members of the heritage communities: archives, libraries, museums and heritage sites

 

Join us on February 26^th or March 27^th 2013 for a Copyright Webinar

The copyright landscape has changed and it affects  those of us in heritage institutions who serve researchers.  As part of its continuing mandate to improve access to and understanding of Canada’s archival heritage, the Canadian Council of Archives (CCA) developed a webinar to inform the archival community about changes to Canada’s new copyright legislation, and we are pleased to offer it to all members of the heritages communities whether they be archives, libraries, museums or heritage sites.

 

What does your staff need to know?  Feedback has been overwhelmingly positive for this timely and informative session.  Staff from over 100 memory institutions have already participated!

 

Tap into the knowledge of session lead Nancy Marrelli, Senior Advisor on Copyright to the CCA Board of Directors. Nancy has closely followed copyright legislation and spearheaded copyright advocacy for the Canadian archival community for many years. 

 

How does the new legislation affect your reference services, your digitization programs? Your donors?  Your preservation program?  Please join us to learn more about Bill C-11 and its implementation.  Spend an interactive 90 minutes with us and learn about how the new amendments will affect your institution and your users.

 

 

Cost:                      Registration is $155 plus GST

 

Sessions:             February 26^th (12:00 to 13:30 EST)

March 27^th (13:00 to 14:30 EDT)

Registration is limited and advance registration will be required. Participants require a telephone and a computer with an Internet connection to fully participate in the Copyright Webinars.

 

 

To register, please complete the attached form at  http://www.cdncouncilarchives.ca/webinars.html

and return it to CCA at your earliest opportunity!

 

Note:  Sessions are available in English only at this time. French sessions may be scheduled if sufficient demand is expressed.  If you would prefer to attend a French session, please indicate your preference via email to [log in to unmask].

 

*_*_*_*

 

 

Pour les membres des communautés vouées au patrimoine: archives, bibliothèques, musées et sites historiques

 

Joignez-vous à nous le 26 février ou le 27 mars 2013 pour un webinaire sur le droit d’auteur

Le monde du droit d’auteur a changé pour nous tous qui sont impliqués dans les organismes voués au patrimoine qui servent les chercheurs.   Dans le cadre de son mandat qui vise à améliorer l’accès au patrimoine archivistique canadien et à en approfondir sa connaissance, le Conseil canadien des archives (CCA) a développé un webinaire sur les amendements à la loi sur le droit d’auteur et nous sommes heureux de l’offrir aux membres des communautés vouées au patrimoine soit les services d’archives, les bibliothèques, les musées ou sites historiques. 

                              

Qu’est-ce que vos employés doivent  connaitre?  Les commentaires reçus ont été extrêmement positifs pour ce webinaire informatif et opportun.  Des employés d’un peu plus de 100 organismes ont déjà participé!

 

Prenez avantage des connaissances de la responsable de la session Nancy Marrelli, Conseillère sur le droit d’auteur auprès du Comité de direction du CCA.  Nancy suit de près l’évolution de  la loi sur le droit d’auteur et elle mène les activités de sensibilisation au sujet du droit d’auteur au nom de la communauté archivistique canadienne depuis de nombreuses années.

 

Quels seront les effets de la nouvelle loi sur votre service de référence, vos projets de numérisation? Vos donateurs? Votre programme de préservation?  Joignez-vous à nous afin d’en apprendre d’avantage à propos de la loi C-11 et de sa mise en œuvre.   Passez un 90 minutes interactif avec nous et apprenez les effets que les amendements à la loi pourraient avoir sur votre institution et vos usagers.

 

 

Frais :                    Les frais d’inscription sont de 155$ plus TPS

 

Sessions :            Le 26 février (12h à 13 :30 HNE)

                Le 27 mars (13h à 14h30 HAE)

Le nombre d’inscription est limité et l’inscription avant les sessions est requise.  Les participants auront besoin d’un téléphone ainsi que d’une connexion Internet afin de pouvoir participer pleinement au webinaire.

 

 

Veuillez compléter le formulaire d’inscription http://www.cdncouncilarchives.ca/f-webinars.html

et le retourner au CCA  le plus tôt possible!

 

Note : Ces deux sessions sont offertes uniquement en anglais. Cependant, des sessions de langue française pourraient être ajoutées au calendrier si nous recevons une demande suffisante pour celles-ci.  Si vous préfèreriez participer à une session en français, veuillez nous l’indiquer par courriel à  l’adresse suivante : [log in to unmask].

 

 

 

Canadian Council of Archives                                              Conseil canadien des archives

130 Albert St.                                                                      130, rue Albert

Suite 1201                                                                            bureau 1201

Ottawa, ON   K1P 5G4                                                         Ottawa, ON   K1P 5G4

 

 

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--_000_EF1297F26DCAEB42A665D2AE78D86DDB01243CDACCASVR01ccaloca_-- ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 09:55:35 -0500 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: "Loshaw, Ann (Vizcaya)" <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01CE1043.C195E0EA" Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> ------_=_NextPart_001_01CE1043.C195E0EA Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I couldn't agree more with presenting yourself professionally! With so many qualified candidates for each job posting, it's also important to follow directions. Unfortunately in my experience a shocking number of candidates did not follow simple directions either requested in the initial job posting or in subsequent communications as the process continued. Paying attention to detail, submitting what was requested and doing so on time were all factors in candidates moving on to the next step in the interview process. From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Candace Perry Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 9:16 AM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates I think Marc's final paragraph says it all. Please - do not discount presenting yourself professionally (I can't stress that enough; it seems to have fallen by the wayside from what I can tell with individuals I have interviewed) - and making yourself stand out. A good cover letter will help, frankly. You have to sell yourself! Candace Perry ________________________________ From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Marc A Williams Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 5:26 PM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates Ashley, My comments come from the perspective of the creator and former director of a masters degree object conservation program (at the Smithsonian, actually). The primary factors affecting your difficulty getting a job are not your fault, in my opinion. They are due to two primary issues. 1) The economy, of course. A lot of us in the museum field are under-employed or unemployed. Many museum employees were laid off. This has created intense competition for a smaller number of jobs. 2) Perhaps more importantly, museum studies and related fields became boutique majors over the last 20 or so years. Many educational institutions wanted to offer programs on undergraduate or graduate levels. There was no consideration of the number of jobs available, which other institutions were also offering training opportunities, or how many graduates would be produced. When I created the training program at the Smithsonian, I was fully aware of other training opportunities throughout the country and the likely number of jobs available for graduates. I determined the number of students to be accepted into the program specifically with the intent NOT to flood the job market. I wanted graduates, whether from my program or another, to be able to find work. This has not happened in the museum studies arena, at least not in the US. From my perspective, the educational institutions have shown blatant disregard for whether their graduates can find jobs in their field. Perhaps I am out of touch, and it is the full responsibility of the student to be sure that there are adequate employment opportunities before they pursue that major. But that is not how I see it, at least as an administrator of a program. It is a shared responsibility. This probably is not very helpful for you in your personal situation. Similar comments to yours have been posted regularly on MuseumL for many years. Many of the responses to your post will contain good information, as do past responses if you want to search the archives. It seems to me that there are two primary themes to increasing the success of landing the job you want. One is luck. This can be enhanced by diligent searching for opportunities and presenting yourself in a professional way, and if possible, in a way that makes you stand out. The other is who you know. If someone knows you and likes your work, they are much more likely to hire you. This is where doing internships, even if unpaid, can be of great benefit. Also go to conferences, presenting a paper if you can. Make helpful comments on MuseumL to the questions of others, particularly on professional issues. Network, not just with peers which is a tendency with recent graduates, but with the decision makers at museums. If you are persistent, you are likely to succeed eventually. Best of wishes in your quest! Marc American Conservation Consortium, Ltd. 4 Rockville Road Broad Brook, CT 06016 www.conservator.com 860-386-6058 Marc A. Williams, President MS in Art Conservation, Winterthur Museum Program Former Chief Wooden Objects Conservator, Smithsonian Institution Fellow, American Institute for Conservation (AIC) On 2/20/13 3:49 PM, "Ashley Watson" <[log in to unmask]> wrote: >Hello, > I graduated with masters in the museum studies at Syracuse University >last May and have not found a job yet despite aggressively applying for >various openings within my experience and skill range. I have completed >an internship at National Museum of Natural History in the exhibits >department and is currently a zooarchaeological/collections intern at the >Museum Support Center till this May. Any recent graduates here that >have the same frustrating experience? Those internships certainly help >keep me sane professionally and personally but I certainly need to begin >LIVING. I want to add one thing that I was more than qualified for one >position at National Museum of Natural History but didn't break through >the annoying human resources "wall". My colleague who was qualified to >the maximum also applied for the same position got the same result. > >========================================================= >Important Subscriber Information: > >The Museum-L FAQ file is located at >http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed >information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail >message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should >read "help" (without the quotes). > >If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to >[log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read >"Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ________________________________ To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 ________________________________ To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ------_=_NextPart_001_01CE1043.C195E0EA Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I couldn’t agree more with presenting yourself professionally!  With so many qualified candidates for each job posting, it’s also important to follow directions. Unfortunately in my experience a shocking number of candidates did not follow simple directions either requested in the initial job posting or in subsequent communications as the process continued.  Paying attention to detail, submitting what was requested and doing so on time were all factors in candidates moving on to the next step in the interview process.

 

From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Candace Perry
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 9:16 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

 

I think Marc’s final paragraph says it all. Please – do not discount presenting yourself professionally (I can’t stress that enough; it seems to have fallen by the wayside from what I can tell with individuals I have interviewed) – and making yourself stand out. A good cover letter will help, frankly. You have to sell yourself!

Candace Perry

 

 

---

From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Marc A Williams
Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 5:26 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

 

Ashley,

 

My comments come from the perspective of the creator and former director of a masters degree object conservation program (at the Smithsonian, actually).  The primary factors affecting your difficulty getting a job are not your fault, in my opinion.  They are due to two primary issues.

 

1) The economy, of course.  A lot of us in the museum field are under-employed or unemployed.  Many museum employees were laid off.  This has created intense competition for a smaller number of jobs.

 

2) Perhaps more importantly, museum studies and related fields became boutique majors over the last 20 or so years.  Many educational institutions wanted to offer programs on undergraduate or graduate levels.  There was no consideration of the number of jobs available, which other institutions were also offering training opportunities, or how many graduates would be produced.  When I created the training program at the Smithsonian, I was fully aware of other training opportunities throughout the country and the likely number of jobs available for graduates.  I determined the number of students to be accepted into the program specifically with the intent NOT to flood the job market.  I wanted graduates, whether from my program or another, to be able to find work.  This has not happened in the museum studies arena, at least not in the US.  From my perspective, the educational institutions have shown blatant disregard for whether their graduates can find jobs in their field.  Perhaps I am out of touch, and it is the full responsibility of the student to be sure that there are adequate employment opportunities before they pursue that major.  But that is not how I see it, at least as an administrator of a program.  It is a shared responsibility.

 

This probably is not very helpful for you in your personal situation.  Similar comments to yours have been posted regularly on MuseumL for many years.  Many of the responses to your post will contain good information, as do past responses if you want to search the archives.  It seems to me that there are two primary themes to increasing the success of landing the job you want.  One is luck.  This can be enhanced by diligent searching for opportunities and presenting yourself in a professional way, and if possible, in a way that makes you stand out.  The other is who you know.  If someone knows you and likes your work, they are much more likely to hire you.  This is where doing internships, even if unpaid, can be of great benefit.  Also go to conferences, presenting a paper if you can.  Make helpful comments on MuseumL to the questions of others, particularly on professional issues.  Network, not just with peers which is a tendency with recent graduates, but with the decision makers at museums.  If you are persistent, you are likely to succeed eventually.  Best of wishes in your quest!

 

Marc

American Conservation Consortium, Ltd.
     4 Rockville Road
     Broad Brook, CT 06016
     www.conservator.com
     860-386-6058

 

Marc A. Williams, President
     MS in Art Conservation, Winterthur Museum Program
     Former Chief Wooden Objects Conservator, Smithsonian Institution
     Fellow, American Institute for Conservation (AIC)

 

On 2/20/13 3:49 PM, "Ashley Watson" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

>Hello,
>   I graduated with masters in the museum studies at Syracuse University
>last May and have not found a job yet despite aggressively applying for
>various openings within my experience and skill range. I have completed
>an internship at National Museum of Natural History in the exhibits
>department and is currently a zooarchaeological/collections intern at the
>Museum Support Center till this May.   Any recent graduates here that
>have the same frustrating experience?   Those internships certainly help
>keep me sane professionally and personally but I certainly need to begin
>LIVING. I want to add one thing that I was more than qualified for one
>position at National Museum of Natural History but didn't break through
>the annoying human resources "wall". My colleague who was qualified to
>the maximum also applied for the same position got the same result.
>
>=========================================================
>Important Subscriber Information:
>
>The Museum-L FAQ file is located at
>http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed
>information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail
>message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should
>read "help" (without the quotes).
>
>If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to
>[log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read
>"Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes).

=========================================================
Important Subscriber Information:

The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes).

If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes).

 

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------_=_NextPart_001_01CE1043.C195E0EA-- ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 12:27:11 -0500 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Matthew White <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]> Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_8C5334A5-3B1D-4909-975D-1A9A1161C5BC" MIME-version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 6.2 \(1499\)) Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> --Apple-Mail=_8C5334A5-3B1D-4909-975D-1A9A1161C5BC Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 On the one hand the advice to follow up on an application is a good one. I did that once and got a great job at which I would still be happily working had life events not intruded. On the other hand this can be a very dangerous step. Contacting an employer when they have told you not to is a wonderful way to demonstrate you can't follow direction. For example, I have taken applications out of contention when hiring when an applicant follows up too soon. (If I tell you the interview process will take two weeks, trust me. I mean that. Don't call me in one week to see how it is going.) You better be darn sure your follow-up overture is in fact welcome. You need to scrutinize every piece of communication you have received from that potential employer and make sure a) they would welcome such an inquiry or at least they have not told you it would be unwelcome and b) you are contacting them in the appropriate manner and appropriate time. Again, you need to read signals and communication carefully. It reminds me a lot of asking a co-worker out on a date. Sure you could find true love and live happily ever after, or you could get hit with a sexual harassment charge and fired. There are no hard and fast rules on this, as with so much else. But here are some things to think about when contacting a potential employer: 1. What have they implicitly or explicitly told you about contacting them? If they tell you no calls, you probably shouldn't call. If they provide an email address for questions but no phone number, take the hint. I have noticed lately that this is more passive than not, especially with those automatically generated confirmation emails you get when you apply through an online process. They tend to say "We will contact the best applicants for interviews." Contact "them" only if they give you an email address or phone number. 2. Going back to my example above, pay attention to timelines. If they tell you two weeks, give them two weeks. If you are following up on an initial application, give them at least 2-3 weeks AFTER THE CLOSING DATE. We are in an era when even entry level jobs receive hundreds of resumes. Going through them all takes time. If it is a large or governmental institution give it a month. It may take that long for the resumes to clear the HR department and get to the desk of someone who is an actual museum professional and contacting the department head would be a waste of time, yours and theirs. And never contact before the application period closes. 3. I agree with Aly below. Two calls or emails, tops. If they don't respond there is a reason. Don't be a pest. 4. I would disagree slightly with Aly in one area, though. Or better I would offer a qualification. If you need to work too hard to figure out who the person is to contact, I would offer the thought that maybe there is a reason why an organization has made this difficult to determine. And what if you guess wrong? For example, I once had a staff member who was responsible for hiring part time docents. I had one of the applicants contact me to ask when she would be interviewed. Aside from the presumption that she deserved an interview at all, I wasn't happy to be contacted for a job I had delegated to someone else and kicked it back to my staff member and it was not a positive conversation. I don't recall whether this woman got an interview or not, though I don't think we hired her. As I mentioned above, and so many people have mentioned on this thread, even entry level positions can get 100's of applications. My hiring experience is that you can lop off about a third as being just plain unqualified or the application just stinks. (I have gotten hand written resume's for example. One had bunny drawings!) Another third is close, but doesn't make the top. Then you are stuck with some very difficult choices between too many applicants who could potentially be great in the position. In the end it is possible for a hiring person or committee to be absolutely frozen with 2 or 3 near perfect applicants. Don't give them a reason to put your resume aside and go with the other person. Again, there are no hard and fast rules, but you need to read each communication carefully. When being interviewed, asking about a hiring timeline and whether they would welcome follow up inquiries is an excellent question. If they hem and haw about this, you may be waiting months to hear back, but if they say a month, give them a month. (I once got a follow up call from an interview a YEAR after the last contact. I had forgotten they existed.) Looking back over this post, I get the sense I am sowing more insecurity. Sorry, but you need to approach each application as unique interactions and there is never a one-size-fits-all approach. Matthew White On Feb 20, 2013, at 6:37 PM, Alyson Mazzone <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > Hi Ashley and and all other new graduates. > > I graduated in 2009 with a masters degree in Historical Administration. I spent the next two years volunteering at a museum and historical society part time, working as a front desk assistant at a different museum part time as well as a seasonal employee at various retail stores and occassionally as a temp. ( At one time I was jumping from 3 jobs in one day). In addition I was applying to jobs and following up on my applications). I can honestly say that except for the volunteer gigs it was one of the most miserable times I can remember. > > Many people gave me advice at that time but here are two things I highly suggest. > > When I finally got my first job my new supervisor said it was because I called to follow up on my application. Calling or emailing someone directly can help to move your resume up. If there was no name with the job announcement for me to contact I would go online and see if I could figure out who was recieving the applications. Of course this didn't work in many situations but I also feel I got called for more interviews this way. Also, be assertive but not too much. I'd call maybe once or twice in two weeks and that was all. > > Secondly, my sister introduced me to the idea of conducting networking interviews. This is where you ask everyone you know if they know someone who works in your field. Hopefully you can meet with these people in person to talk and essentially gain some career advice. > > This is your chance to... > A) pick their brain about their experience > B) to come away with another name and meet more people in the field > and > C) put your name out there so hopefully when the next job in their museum comes around they will remember you (I did a networking interview once and a month later the person called to tell me a job at their museum was about to be posted). > > Good luck to all of you searching for jobs. > > -Aly > > > > On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 2:57 PM, Cindi Verser <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > You highlight the information by putting an emphasis on the skills they want, not by the font of boldness of the letters. This type of resume focuses on your accomplishments and skills learned at school and through your internships. It also works well if you have a number of different interests, internships or volunteer positions. Instead of listing experience in chronological order, you start with skill sets and then list your achievements. Put them in order of importance and emphasize the major skills they are looking for. So you will probably have only 3 or 4 groupings. > > > Like this… > > > Skill > > 1st Achievement > > 2nd Achievement > > > The skill you want to highlight might be art handling. In that case, you would put that and then several highlights. Here are a few random ideas… > > > Art Handling > > -Assisted with the installation of Greek sculpture for the XXX exhibit at YY institution. > > --Responsible for the deinstallation and transport of 30 artifacts…. > > > Cataloging > > -Cleared a backlog of ### new accessions…. > > - Completed a major accession project involving WW II letters during an internship with the Alphabet Museum. > > > Give enough detail on the achievements to cover the basic information. By doing this, you let them know what you have accomplished and what you can do for them. > > > The rest of the resume contains usual information---the objective, a list of employment history, education and certifications, etc. > > > There are samples online but here is one site to get you started. http://www.worksmart.ca.gov/tips_resume_functional.html > > Check out a number of the samples because there are some variations on the functional resume that you may like better than others. Pick what seems most comfortable for you to work with. > > > When I got out of school I almost always used a functional resume and applied to a number of different positions. And so did my kids. We almost always got the interviews we wanted. > > > You also might consider registering with the local employment commission. They usually offer free classes in interview skills to help once the resume does its job. The right resume will get you in the door, but you will have to be prepared for the interview process to get the job. The employment commission can also offer skills testing to better focus your job search and referrals for job openings. If your college may also have these services available for students at no cost. > > > Hope this helps. > > > > > From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Ashley Watson > Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 5:03 PM > > > To: [log in to unmask] > Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates > > > > Cindi, > > You mean that I highlight key information by making it bold? > > > Ashley > > > On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 4:55 PM, Cindi Verser <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > > A lot of institutions are hiring from within. I volunteered at a museum while working a different job. The staff knew I was actively job hunting and contacted me when they had a position open. > > Although It was a temporary contract job that lasted 2 years, it lead to a permanent, full-time position at another museum. Where I work now, the last person hired in my department also started out as a volunteer. > > > Also take a look at your resume. Are you tailoring it to each job opening or do you send out the same one each time? For example, if they are looking for someone to handle a lot of cataloging, are you highlighting your experience in that area? If you are using a standard format then consider changing to a functional style that will highlight your experiences better. When the HR people are dealing with a high volume of applications, you need to catch their attention. If they are skimming resumes and looking for key words and phrases, they aren’t going to take the time to pick the information out of your submission. Get their attention so they see you as a possible candidate and you will get the interview. > > > Good luck in your search. > > Cindi > > > From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Janet Tham > Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 4:06 PM > To: [log in to unmask] > Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates > > > I am (and I am sure many others) currently struggling under the same issues. It is not only the Museum world. Any institution with a good reputation is bound to receive a high volume of 'qualified' options. Unfortunately, amongst thousands of possible applicants, it would not be a surprise if they never reach your application before the position is filled. Standing out in the human resources department could be as little as having a reference from inside the institution. It is sad to think that getting a job today is based on who you know...but in my experience I believe it to be true. > > > Try cold calls/emails to individuals within the institution you are applying via LinkedIN - or using your school's alumni network. You never know who may help to push your application along. > > > > Best, > > > > > On Feb 20, 2013, at 3:57 PM, . . wrote: > > > About ten years ago now, I ran into the same problem. If you go through the archives of the list, you'll see MANY people have. (Didn't we just have this discussion last month?) I gave up after two years of fighting to get a museum job and went into another field where I could do research. Is my current job my dream job? No. Do I get paid enough I can actually live and pay off my student loans? Yes! > > I now has a somewhat sucessful blog regarding history as an outlet for what I love. > > > Sincerely, > > Isabella > > > > > Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2013 15:49:09 -0500 > > From: > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 > > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 > > > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 > > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 > > > > > -- > > Alyson K. Mazzone > [log in to unmask] > > > One ship drives east and the other drives west while the self same breezes blow. > Tis the set of the sails and not the gales That determines the way they go. > Like the birds of the air are the ways of fate. As we journey along through life. > Tis the set of the soul that determines the goal. And not the storm and the strife. > ~ Ella Wheeler Wilcox > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 > ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). --Apple-Mail=_8C5334A5-3B1D-4909-975D-1A9A1161C5BC Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252

On the one hand the advice to follow up on an application is a good one. I did that once and got a great job at which I would still be happily working had life events not intruded. On the other hand this can be a very dangerous step. Contacting an employer  when they have told you not to is a wonderful way to demonstrate you can't follow direction. For example, I have taken applications out of contention when hiring when an applicant follows up too soon. (If I tell you the interview process will take two weeks, trust me. I mean that. Don't call me in one week to see how it is going.)  You better be darn sure your follow-up overture is in fact welcome. You need to scrutinize every piece of communication you have received from that potential employer and make sure a) they would welcome such an inquiry or at least they have not told you it would be unwelcome and b) you are contacting them in the appropriate manner and appropriate time. Again, you need to read signals and communication carefully. It reminds me a lot of asking a co-worker out on a date. Sure you could find true love and live happily ever after, or you could get hit with a sexual harassment charge and fired. 

There are no hard and fast rules on this, as with so much else. But here are some things to think about when contacting a potential employer:

1. What have they implicitly or explicitly told you about contacting them? If they tell you no calls, you probably shouldn't call. If they provide an email address for questions but no phone number, take the hint. I have noticed lately that this is more passive than not, especially with those automatically generated confirmation emails you get when you apply through an online process. They tend to say "We will contact the best applicants for interviews." Contact "them" only if they give you an email address or phone number.

2. Going back to my example above, pay attention to timelines. If they tell you two weeks, give them two weeks. If you are following up on an initial application, give them at least 2-3 weeks AFTER THE CLOSING DATE. We are in an era when even entry level jobs receive hundreds of resumes. Going through them all takes time. If it is a large or governmental institution give it a month. It may take that long for the resumes to clear the HR department and get to the desk of someone who is an actual museum professional and contacting the department head would be a waste of time, yours and theirs. And never contact before the application period closes.

3. I agree with Aly below. Two calls or emails, tops. If they don't respond there is a reason.  Don't be a pest.

4.  I would disagree slightly with Aly in one area, though. Or better I would offer a qualification. If you need to work too hard to figure out who the person is to contact, I would offer the thought that maybe there is a reason why an organization has made this difficult to determine. And what if you guess wrong? For example, I once had a staff member who was responsible for hiring part time docents. I had one of the applicants contact me to ask when she would be interviewed. Aside from the presumption that she deserved an interview at all, I wasn't happy to be contacted for a job I had delegated to someone else and kicked it back to my staff member and it was not a positive conversation. I don't recall whether this woman got an interview or not, though I don't think we hired her. 

As I mentioned above, and so many people have mentioned on this thread, even entry level positions can get 100's of applications. My hiring experience is that you can lop off about a third as being just plain unqualified or the application just stinks. (I have gotten hand written resume's for example. One had bunny drawings!)  Another third is close, but doesn't make the top. Then you are stuck with some very difficult choices between too many applicants who could potentially be great in the position. In the end it is possible for a hiring person or committee to be absolutely frozen with 2 or 3 near perfect applicants. Don't give them a reason to put your resume aside and go with the other person. 

Again, there are no hard and fast rules, but you need to read each communication carefully. When being interviewed, asking about a hiring timeline and whether they would welcome follow up inquiries is an excellent question. If they hem and haw about this, you may be waiting months to hear back, but if they say a month, give them a month. (I once got a follow up call from an interview a YEAR after the last contact. I had forgotten they existed.)

Looking back over this post, I get the sense I am sowing more insecurity. Sorry, but you need to approach each application as unique interactions and there is never a one-size-fits-all approach.

Matthew White

On Feb 20, 2013, at 6:37 PM, Alyson Mazzone <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Hi Ashley and and all other new graduates.

 

I graduated in 2009 with a masters degree in Historical Administration. I spent the next two years volunteering at a museum and historical society part time, working as a front desk assistant at a different museum part time as well as a seasonal employee at various retail stores and occassionally as a temp. ( At one time I was jumping from 3 jobs in one day). In addition I was applying to jobs and following up on my applications).  I can honestly say that except for the volunteer gigs it was one of the most miserable times I can remember.

 

Many people gave me advice at that time but here are two things I highly suggest.

 

When I finally got my first job my new supervisor said it was because I called to follow up on my application. Calling or emailing someone directly can help to move your resume up. If there was no name with the job announcement for me to contact I would go online and see if I could figure out who was recieving the applications. Of course this didn't work in many situations but I also feel I got called for more interviews this way.  Also, be assertive but not too much. I'd call maybe once or twice in two weeks and that was all.

 

Secondly, my sister introduced me to the idea of conducting networking interviews. This is where you ask everyone you know if they know someone who works in your field. Hopefully you can meet with these people in person to talk and essentially gain some career advice.

 

This is your chance to...

A) pick their brain about their experience 

B) to come away with another name and meet more people in the field

and

C) put your name out there so hopefully when the next job in their museum comes around they will remember you (I did a networking interview once and a month later the person called to tell me a job at their museum was about to be posted).

 

Good luck to all of you searching for jobs.

 

-Aly 

 

On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 2:57 PM, Cindi Verser <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

You highlight the information by putting an emphasis on the skills they want, not by the font of boldness of the letters.  This type of resume focuses on your accomplishments and skills learned at school and through your internships.  It also works well if you have a number of different interests, internships or volunteer positions.    Instead of listing experience in chronological order, you start with skill sets and then list your achievements.   Put them in order of importance and emphasize the major skills they are looking for.  So you will probably have only 3 or 4 groupings.  

 

Like this…

 

Skill

1^st Achievement

2^nd Achievement

 

The skill you want to highlight might be art handling.  In that case, you would put that and then several highlights. Here are a few random ideas…

 

Art Handling

-Assisted with the installation of Greek sculpture  for the XXX exhibit at YY institution. 

--Responsible for  the deinstallation and transport of 30 artifacts….

 

Cataloging

-Cleared a backlog of ### new accessions….

- Completed a major accession project involving WW II letters during an internship with the Alphabet Museum.

 

Give enough detail on the achievements to cover the basic information. By doing this, you let them know what you have accomplished and what you can do for them.

 

The rest of the resume contains  usual information---the objective, a list of employment history, education and certifications, etc. 

 

There are samples online but here is one site to get you started.   http://www.worksmart.ca.gov/tips_resume_functional.html

Check out a number of the samples because there are some variations on the functional resume that you may like better than others.  Pick what seems most comfortable for you to work with.

 

When I got out of school I almost always used a functional resume and applied to a number of different positions.  And so did my kids.  We almost always got the interviews we wanted.

 

You also might consider registering with the local employment commission.  They usually offer free classes in interview skills to help once the resume does its job.    The right resume will get you in the door, but you will have to be prepared for the interview process to get the job.   The employment commission can also offer skills testing to better focus your job search and referrals for job openings.  If your college may also have these services available for students at no cost.

 

Hope this helps.

 

 

From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Ashley Watson
Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 5:03 PM

To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

 

Cindi,

   You mean that I highlight key information by making it bold?   

 

Ashley 

 

On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 4:55 PM, Cindi Verser <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

A lot of institutions are hiring from within.  I volunteered at a museum while working a different job.  The staff knew I was actively  job hunting and contacted me when they had a position open.   

Although It was a temporary contract job that lasted 2 years, it lead to a permanent,  full-time position at another museum.   Where I work now, the last person hired in my department also started out as a volunteer.

 

Also take a look at your resume.   Are you tailoring it to each job opening or do  you  send out the same one each time?   For example, if they are looking for someone to handle a lot of cataloging,   are you highlighting your experience in that area?  If you are using a standard format then consider changing to a functional style that will highlight your experiences better.   When the HR people are dealing with a high volume of  applications, you need to catch their attention.  If they are skimming resumes and looking for key words and phrases, they aren’t going to  take the time to pick the information out of your submission.    Get their attention so they see you as a possible candidate  and  you will get the interview. 

 

Good luck in your search.

Cindi

 

From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Janet Tham
Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 4:06 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

 

I am (and I am sure many others) currently struggling under the same issues. It is not only the Museum world. Any institution with a good reputation is bound to receive a high volume of 'qualified' options. Unfortunately, amongst thousands of possible applicants, it would not be a surprise if they never reach your application before the position is filled. Standing out in the human resources department could be as little as having a reference from inside the institution. It is sad to think that getting a job today is based on who you know...but in my experience I believe it to be true. 

 

Try cold calls/emails to individuals within the institution you are applying via LinkedIN - or using your school's alumni network. You never know who may help to push your application along. 

 

 

Best,

 

 

 

On Feb 20, 2013, at 3:57 PM, . . wrote:

 

About ten years ago now, I ran into the same problem.  If you go through the archives of the list, you'll see MANY people have.  (Didn't we just have this discussion last month?) I gave up after two years of fighting to get a museum job and went into another field where I could do research. Is my current job my dream job?  No.  Do I get paid enough I can actually live and pay off my student loans?  Yes!   
 
 I now has a somewhat sucessful blog regarding history as an outlet for what I love. 
 
 
Sincerely, 
 
Isabella
 
 

> Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2013 15:49:09 -0500
> From:

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Alyson K. Mazzone
[log in to unmask]

 

One ship drives east and the other drives west while the self same breezes blow.

Tis the set of the sails and not the gales That determines the way they go.

Like the birds of the air are the ways of fate. As we journey along through life.

Tis the set of the soul that determines the goal. And not the storm and the strife.

~ Ella Wheeler Wilcox

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--Apple-Mail=_8C5334A5-3B1D-4909-975D-1A9A1161C5BC-- ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 14:13:49 -0500 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Matthew White <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]> Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_E2BA82A0-2E66-4594-95B6-39CBF45BE5CD" MIME-version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 6.2 \(1499\)) Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> --Apple-Mail=_E2BA82A0-2E66-4594-95B6-39CBF45BE5CD Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Having been on both sides of this issue I can see, oddly enough, both sides. As a general rule, I think it is the applicant's decision which burden's to bear to be interviewed or take a job whether it involves relocation, buying a new wardrobe, or some other task or expense not directly related to the job. It is also perfectly legitimate to ask that applicant during the interview how they plan to do it and not be satisfied with the answer. (assuming the topic does not fall into an area explicitly forbidden to ask about). One the other hand I can see why an institution might want limit potential applicants to people they think can realistically take the job with minimal burden and within a reasonable time frame. (Relocation takes a lot more time for a person to start) Hiring a position is a lot of work, and no one wants to do it more than they have to. An institution wants to make sure they don't have to go through the whole thing in a month because the successful candidate couldn't afford the move after all or do it a year later because he or she didn't like the country (or the city) after all and/or got homesick. Advertising only locally is a fine way to maximize quality applicants. (Quality defined here as someone in a solid position to start the job quickly, and ensure some longevity) But the way position announcements travel the internet, I am not sure that is the best solution. More and more I have noticed announcements put in phrases like "preference shown to local applicants" or "preference shown to applicants who can start by X date." I think that is perfectly legitimate. After that it is up to the applicant to cross those bears. Regardless, I think the best is for everyone involved to be as honest as possible about salaries, relocation reimbursement, interview travel reimbursement, etc. Someone else mentioned a little white lie when saying you planned to relocate. Fine, I see that and there are a lot of shadings in any social interaction. But if that blows up later, there will be trouble and proof of lying during the application process is one of the few absolute, no questions asked fireable offenses. Play that game very carefully. (Say I am under the impression you were relocating to my town whether you got my job or not and you tell me when, because I will certainly ask what your plans are in that regard. If you don't start when you say you can start and I find out you lied about your plans and intent, there is going to be trouble.) And on a side note. If a hiring institution promises to reimburse for travel expenses for an interview, it is unprofessional and morally wrong to renege on that. I am still owed money by an institution that promised to reimburse for meals and local transportation when I flew across the country for an interview and I have found this is not as rare as we would hope. And while I am getting things out there, while I can agree there are many shadings and strategies on this topic in the hiring process, there is one habit which I cannot abide and I think if there is pure evil in this regard, this is it. That is putting applicants through the interview process when you know they have no hope of ever getting the job. We all know the "wired" job announcements exist. These are jobs that are officially open, but the position is already going to a specific person and the announcement is merely a formality. This is done for a variety of reasons and I understand it is part of the game. I don't like it, but I understand it. Hate the game, not the player etc etc. But to put an applicant through the interview process, including costly investments in wardrobe, travel, time off from existing jobs, and other expenses when they have little if any chance of getting the job is just wrong and it happens all the time. I feel very strongly about this. I have been interviewed for no less than 6 jobs (that I know of) that I later found out I had no chance at because they were already promised to someone else. So though I agree the burden should be on the applicant, if an institution really only wants local applicants, whether to keep the resumes to a minimum, maximize retention, or to speed the hiring process, fine. But don't string someone along if you don't think you will hire them. It's easy to do because job searchers as a group are probably poorer, more desperate, and eager for any opportunity. But just don't. Sorry that turned in to a rant there, but this really makes me angry and the young professionals out there need to know what's out there. Matthew White > I can appreciate what you're saying, Jamie. But honestly, I wonder if it isn't more of a financial hardship on these grads to not have jobs than to spend a few hundred bucks on an interview. I mean, I wouldn't do it for the first interview. But at the second interview level (first via phone), they have a better sense of their chances and it could be a justifiable expense. Especially if they live in cities that are crowded with museum studies graduates--there might not be 10 but rather hundreds of local applicants for every job. But they also wouldn't want to just move to a new place without a job offer in hand just to become a local--especially to cities with fewer opportunities or high living expenses. They're caught between a rock and a hard place. > Cheers, > Shana > > > On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:52 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > From the Museum perspective, I think a small to medium museum is not going to consider an out-of-State candidate if they are located more than a reasonable day trip away from the museum they apply to because the museum does not have the resources to reimburse each candidate for travel and they do realize that these candidates are just starting out and do not have the means to fly in for an interview for an entry level job either. That is why we keep our search State wide for entry level positions. Please keep in mind that we typically receive at least 50 resumes for such positions, all of which have basically the same level of education and experience and at least 10 of these candidates are fairly local, so there is no shortage of qualified local candidates. If we did advertise nationwide for such positions, I would really have a hard time as a human being asking a candidate to fly in knowing, at this stage in their career, it would cause them financial hardship when they are competing against so many other candidates with basically the same credentials. I would really concentrate my search locally, try and attain an entry level position and then take it from there. Certainly when you are ready to move on to a higher position, the search parameters widen and you can cast your net wider as well. > > > > Jamie > > > > From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Shana West > Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 9:27 AM > To: [log in to unmask] > Subject: SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates > > > > I have found it puzzling when museums I applied to in other states weren't interested because I wasn't local. I moved across the country for my first, entry-level museum job. Many graduates would jump at the chance for a full time job, regardless of location. So when grads have come to me asking for advice on applying out of state, I've told them to say they're already planning on moving to that city independently of the job (yes, it's a white lie). That way, the hiring museum won't feel like they have to pay expenses. > > > > I haven't tried it myself, but I was in a situation where I was actually moving to a new city and applying for a job. I don't think I would have been considered had I not already been planning a move. In fact, I'm pretty sure they asked me on the phone interview, "And you're definitely moving here?" > > > > Just an idea. > > Shana > > > > On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:08 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > > Hi All: > > I have posted positions on local sites before, such as MANY (Museum Association of the State of NY) and I have interviewed and hired candidates from these postings. Perhaps you need to look at State museum organizations rather than national organizations to post your resume on. I know from the Museum perspective, we are not interested in a nationwide search to fill an entry level position, so we keep the posting local, or at least at the State level. > > > > Hope this helps and good luck, > > Jamie Smith Quinn > > Executive Director > > FASNY Museum of Firefighting > > > > From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Laurie A Sedicino > Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 11:08 PM > > > To: [log in to unmask] > Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates > > > > I would also be interested in the answer to Matthew’s question. I have to agree that - at least for museum field jobs – I have never once experienced museum search committees using posted resume sources…and I have never been contacted through these sources. I would like to hear along with Matthew if you think these are good uses of such spare job search time and energy?? > > > > Thanks > > Laurie > > > > From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Matthew White > Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 4:52 PM > To: [log in to unmask] > Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates > > > > I have a question for the group that is tangentially related. > > > > There are several professional organizations that invite those looking for a job to post their resumes and particulars. (I have posted at both AAM and AASLH. I am sure there are similar sites in other niches of the field.) I have also posted on Linked-In. As anyone who has ever done this knows, it can be kind of time consuming to enter and keep current. > > > > Has anyone ever gotten contact through one of these services? An interview? A job? > > > > For those of you who have hired recently, did you use these services? If not why not? > > > > What about Linked-In? > > > > Personally, I know a lot of people in the job market and even a good number who hire and I have never heard of ANYONE even being contacted through one of these services, let alone get a job. > > > > Does anyone think these are good uses of spare job search time and energy? > > > > Matthew White > > On Feb 20, 2013, at 4:34 PM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > > > > Hello all, > > I want to thank you all for sharing your experiences and the advice. I already decided to open my search wide open to start somewhere. I had two job interviews that took the place last November but didn't get the job. I received a PERSONAL email from a museum to inform me that my professional package has been forwarded directly to the museum director. So it certainly passed the human resources wall. So with that, should I check with them for the status progression? > > > > One more thing: > > In response to Allison Bott, despite my name giving an implication that I would be a female, I am actually a male. That is alright. I will read the article in the link you provided as it may apply to me as I am also in the minority as i am Deaf. So I face the same challenges as others who are in the minorities. > > > > Ashley Watson > > > > On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 4:24 PM, Jillian Shoblock <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > > I have been applying since December 2011 when I graduated with my MA in Museum Studies an have only had 2 interviews. Do I get frustrated a lot, yes but I haven't given up hope yet. I do still have an active social life and work in management in retail. Is that what I want? Definitely not. I intern at a museum that I love and would love to be able to work at. But can't afford to hire me so right now I am getting a little of what I love to do. What I have found is trying to stay positive even though I have applied to well over 100 positions all dealing with collections management and most with history, since that is one of my undergraduate degrees, is what keeps me going. Try to enjoy your life outside the museum an continue to visit museums. If you can't find a job in I e and have to work elsewhere then volunteer so you still get your fill. I know it sucks, trust me all my friends have full time jobs and are "living the life" but I have to believe that my time will come. Also my one friend keeps telling me to look at higher Ed jobs like academic advising if you have a masters. Just a thought. Good luck and keep your head up! > > Jillian > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Feb 20, 2013, at 3:58 PM, "Jentzsch, Tracy" <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > > > Ashley, for you and others searching for job leads, I would recommend a > > free resource we offer through the University of Delaware's Museum Studies > > Program. MuseWeekly is our weekly electronic news that provides job > > posts, internships, conferences, calls for papers, announcements and news > > related to all things "museum". We never rent or sell our list, and there > > is always a plethora of good leads. You can sign up for this free > > resource by going to our website, www.udel.edu/museumstudies and filing in > > the three question form on the index page. Good luck to you. > > > > > > > > Tracy H. Jentzsch > > Staff Assistant, Museum Studies Program > > University of Delaware > > 302.831.1251 > > Www.udel.edu/museumstudies > > > > > > > > > > > > On 2/20/13 3:49 PM, "Ashley Watson" <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > > > >> Hello, > >> I graduated with masters in the museum studies at Syracuse University > >> last May and have not found a job yet despite aggressively applying for > >> various openings within my experience and skill range. I have completed > >> an internship at National Museum of Natural History in the exhibits > >> department and is currently a zooarchaeological/collections intern at the > >> Museum Support Center till this May. Any recent graduates here that > >> have the same frustrating experience? Those internships certainly help > >> keep me sane professionally and personally but I certainly need to begin > >> LIVING. I want to add one thing that I was more than qualified for one > >> position at National Museum of Natural History but didn't break through > >> the annoying human resources "wall". My colleague who was qualified to > >> the maximum also applied for the same position got the same result. > >> > >> ========================================================= > >> Important Subscriber Information: > >> > >> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at > >> http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed > >> information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail > >> message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should > >> read "help" (without the quotes). > >> > >> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to > >> [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read > >> "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). > > > > ========================================================= > > Important Subscriber Information: > > > > > The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] .. The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). > > > > > > If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). > > ========================================================= > Important Subscriber Information: > > The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). > > If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). > > > > > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 > > > > > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 > > > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 > > > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 > > > > > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 > > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 > > > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 > ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). --Apple-Mail=_E2BA82A0-2E66-4594-95B6-39CBF45BE5CD Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Having been on both sides of this issue I can see, oddly enough, both sides. As a general rule, I think it is the applicant's decision which burden's to bear to be interviewed or take a job whether it involves relocation, buying a new wardrobe, or some other task or expense not directly related to the job. It is also perfectly legitimate to ask that applicant during the interview how they plan to do it and not be satisfied with the answer. (assuming the topic does not fall into an area explicitly forbidden to ask about).

One the other hand I can see why an institution might want limit potential applicants to people they think can realistically take the job with minimal burden and within a reasonable time frame. (Relocation takes a lot more time for a person to start)  Hiring a position is a lot of work, and no one wants to do it more than they have to. An institution wants to make sure they don't have to go through the whole thing in a month because the successful candidate couldn't afford the move after all or do it a year later because he or she didn't like the country (or the city) after all and/or got homesick. Advertising only locally is a fine way to maximize quality applicants. (Quality defined here as someone in a solid position to start the job quickly, and ensure some longevity) But the way position announcements travel the internet, I am not sure that is the best solution. More and more I have noticed announcements put in phrases like "preference shown to local applicants" or "preference shown to applicants who can start by X date." I think that is perfectly legitimate. After that it is up to the applicant to cross those bears.

Regardless, I think the best is for everyone involved to be as honest as possible about salaries, relocation reimbursement, interview travel reimbursement, etc. Someone else mentioned a little white lie when saying you planned to relocate. Fine, I see that and there are a lot of shadings in any social interaction. But if that blows up later, there will be trouble and proof of lying during the application process is one of the few absolute, no questions asked fireable offenses. Play that game very carefully. (Say I am under the impression you were relocating to my town whether you got my job or not and you tell me when, because I will certainly ask what your plans are in that regard. If you don't start when you say you can start and I find out you lied about your plans and intent, there is going to be trouble.) 

And on a side note. If a hiring institution promises to reimburse for travel expenses for an interview, it is unprofessional and morally wrong to renege on that. I am still owed money by an institution that promised to reimburse for meals and local transportation when I flew across the country for an interview and I have found this is not as rare as we would hope.

And while I am getting things out there, while I can agree there are many shadings and strategies on this topic in the hiring process, there is one habit which I cannot abide and I think if there is pure evil in this regard, this is it.  That is putting applicants through the interview process when you know they have no hope of ever getting the job. We all know the "wired" job announcements exist. These are jobs that are officially open, but the position is already going to a specific person and the announcement is merely a formality. This is done for a variety of reasons and I understand it is part of the game. I don't like it, but I understand it. Hate the game, not the player etc etc. But to put an applicant through the interview process, including costly investments in wardrobe, travel, time off from existing jobs, and other expenses when they have little if any chance of getting the job is just wrong and it happens all the time. I feel very strongly about this. I have been interviewed for no less than 6 jobs (that I know of) that I later found out I had no chance at because they were already promised to someone else.

So though I agree the burden should be on the applicant, if an institution really only wants local applicants, whether to keep the resumes to a minimum, maximize retention, or to speed the hiring process, fine. But don't string someone along if you don't think you will hire them. It's easy to do because job searchers as a group are probably poorer, more desperate, and eager for any opportunity. But just don't.

Sorry that turned in to a rant there, but this really makes me angry and the young professionals out there need to know what's out there.

Matthew White

I can appreciate what you're saying, Jamie. But honestly, I wonder if it isn't more of a financial hardship on these grads to not have jobs than to spend a few hundred bucks on an interview. I mean, I wouldn't do it for the first interview. But at the second interview level (first via phone), they have a better sense of their chances and it could be a justifiable expense. Especially if they live in cities that are crowded with museum studies graduates--there might not be 10 but rather hundreds of local applicants for every job. But they also wouldn't want to just move to a new place without a job offer in hand just to become a local--especially to cities with fewer opportunities or high living expenses. They're caught between a rock and a hard place.

Cheers,

Shana

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:52 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

From the Museum perspective, I think a small to medium museum is not going to consider an out-of-State candidate if they are located more than a reasonable day trip away from the museum they apply to because the museum does not have the resources to reimburse each candidate for travel and they do realize that these candidates are just starting out and do not have the means to fly in for an interview for an entry level job either. That is why we keep our search State wide for entry level positions. Please keep in mind that we typically receive at least 50 resumes for such positions, all of which have basically the same level of education and experience and at least 10 of these candidates are fairly local, so there is no shortage of qualified local candidates. If we did advertise nationwide for such positions, I would really have a hard time as a human being asking a candidate to fly in knowing, at this stage in their career, it would cause them financial hardship when they are competing against so many other candidates with basically the same credentials. I would really concentrate my search locally, try and attain an entry level position and then take it from there. Certainly when you are ready to move on to a higher position, the search parameters widen and you can cast your net wider as well.

 

Jamie

 

From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Shana West
Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 9:27 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

 

I have found it puzzling when museums I applied to in other states weren't interested because I wasn't local. I moved across the country for my first, entry-level museum job. Many graduates would jump at the chance for a full time job, regardless of location. So when grads have come to me asking for advice on applying out of state, I've told them to say they're already planning on moving to that city independently of the job (yes, it's a white lie). That way, the hiring museum won't feel like they have to pay expenses. 

 

I haven't tried it myself, but I was in a situation where I was actually moving to a new city and applying for a job. I don't think I would have been considered had I not already been planning a move. In fact, I'm pretty sure they asked me on the phone interview, "And you're definitely moving here?" 

 

Just an idea.

Shana

 

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:08 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Hi All:

I have posted positions on local sites before, such as MANY (Museum Association of the State of NY) and I have interviewed and hired candidates from these postings. Perhaps you need to look at State museum organizations rather than national organizations to post your resume on. I know from the Museum perspective, we are not interested in a nationwide search to fill an entry level position, so we keep the posting local, or at least at the State level.

 

Hope this helps and good luck,

Jamie Smith Quinn

Executive Director

FASNY Museum of Firefighting

 

From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Laurie A Sedicino
Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 11:08 PM

To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

 

I would also be interested in the answer to Matthew’s question.  I have to agree that - at least for museum field jobs – I have never once experienced museum search committees using posted resume sources…and I have never been contacted through these sources.  I would like to hear along with Matthew if you think these are good uses of such spare job search time and energy??

 

Thanks

Laurie

 

---

From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Matthew White
Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 4:52 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates

 

I have a question for the group that is tangentially related.

 

There are several professional organizations that invite those looking for a job to post their resumes and particulars. (I have posted at both AAM and AASLH. I am sure there are similar sites in other niches of the field.) I have also posted on Linked-In. As anyone who has ever done this knows, it can be kind of time consuming to enter and keep current. 

 

Has anyone ever gotten contact through one of these services? An interview? A job?

 

For those of you who have hired recently, did you use these services? If not why not?

 

What about Linked-In?

 

Personally, I know a lot of people in the job market and even a good number who hire and I have never heard of ANYONE even being contacted through one of these services, let alone get a job.

 

Does anyone think these are good uses of spare job search time and energy?

 

Matthew White

On Feb 20, 2013, at 4:34 PM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

 

Hello all,  

   I want to thank you all for sharing your experiences and the advice.  I already decided to open my search wide open to start somewhere.   I had two job interviews that took the place last November but didn't get the job. I received a PERSONAL email from a museum to inform me that my professional package has been forwarded directly to the museum director.  So it certainly passed the human resources wall. So with that, should I check with them for the status progression?   

 

One more thing:

In response to Allison Bott,  despite my name giving an implication that I would be a female, I am actually a male. That is alright.  I will read the article in the link you provided as it may apply to me as I am also in the minority as i am Deaf.   So I face the same challenges as others who are in the minorities. 

 

Ashley Watson

 

On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 4:24 PM, Jillian Shoblock <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

I have been applying since December 2011 when I graduated with my MA in Museum Studies an have only had 2 interviews. Do I get frustrated a lot, yes but I haven't given up hope yet. I do still have an active social life and work in management in retail. Is that what I want? Definitely not. I intern at a museum that I love and would love to be able to work at. But can't afford to hire me so right now I am getting a little of what I love to do. What I have found is trying to stay positive even though I have applied to well over 100 positions all dealing with collections management and most with history, since that is one of my undergraduate degrees, is what keeps me going. Try to enjoy your life outside the museum an continue to visit museums. If you can't find a job in I e and have to work elsewhere then volunteer so you still get your fill. I know it sucks, trust me all my friends have full time jobs and are "living the life" but I have to believe that my time will come. Also my one friend keeps telling me to look at higher Ed jobs like academic advising if you have a masters. Just a thought. Good luck and keep your head up!

Jillian

Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 20, 2013, at 3:58 PM, "Jentzsch, Tracy" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> Ashley, for you and others searching for job leads, I would recommend a
> free resource we offer through the University of Delaware's Museum Studies
> Program.  MuseWeekly is our weekly electronic news that provides job
> posts, internships, conferences, calls for papers, announcements and news
> related to all things "museum".  We never rent or sell our list, and there
> is always a plethora of good leads.  You can sign up for this free
> resource by going to our website, www.udel.edu/museumstudies and filing in
> the three question form on the index page.  Good luck to you.
>
>
>
> Tracy H. Jentzsch
> Staff Assistant, Museum Studies Program
> University of Delaware
> 302.831.1251
> Www.udel.edu/museumstudies
>
>
>
>
>
> On 2/20/13 3:49 PM, "Ashley Watson" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>> Hello,
>>  I graduated with masters in the museum studies at Syracuse University
>> last May and have not found a job yet despite aggressively applying for
>> various openings within my experience and skill range. I have completed
>> an internship at National Museum of Natural History in the exhibits
>> department and is currently a zooarchaeological/collections intern at the
>> Museum Support Center till this May.   Any recent graduates here that
>> have the same frustrating experience?   Those internships certainly help
>> keep me sane professionally and personally but I certainly need to begin
>> LIVING. I want to add one thing that I was more than qualified for one
>> position at National Museum of Natural History but didn't break through
>> the annoying human resources "wall". My colleague who was qualified to
>> the maximum also applied for the same position got the same result.
>>
>> =========================================================
>> Important Subscriber Information:
>>
>> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at
>> http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed
>> information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail
>> message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should
>> read "help" (without the quotes).
>>
>> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to
>> [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read
>> "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes).
>
> =========================================================
> Important Subscriber Information:
>

> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] .. The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes).

>
> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes).

=========================================================
Important Subscriber Information:

The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes).

If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes).

 

 

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--Apple-Mail=_E2BA82A0-2E66-4594-95B6-39CBF45BE5CD-- ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 13:30:03 -0600 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Brad Bredehoft <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Disaster Plan Research and Writing online course starts March 4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> Disasters and emergencies occur without notice, anytime, anywhere. If you have thought about possible contingencies, done drills and practiced recovery, it will have a significantly lower impact on the staff, visitors and collection. Disaster Plan Research and Writing is an amazing course that organizes all of the information you need to have an effective and swift response. If you are still struggling to start, or complete, your institutional disaster plan, consider taking this course. MS 205/6: Disaster Plan Research and Writing Instructor: Terri Schindel Dates:Mar 4 to Apr 26, 2013 Price: $495 Location: Online at www.museumclasses.org Description: Every museum, library and archive needs to be prepared for fires, floods, chemical spills, tornadoes, hurricanes and other disasters. But surveys show 80 percent lack trained staff, emergency-preparedness plans for their collections, or both. Disaster Plan Research and Writing begins with the creation of disaster-preparedness teams, the importance of ongoing planning, employee safety, board participation and insurance. Participants will learn everything they need to draft their own disaster-preparedness plans. They also will be required to incorporate colleagues in team-building exercises. A written disaster-preparedness plan is not only a good idea, it's also a requirement for accreditation. In the second half of the course, instructor Terri Schindel reviews and provides input as participants write plans that outline the procedures to follow in various emergencies. The completed plan prepares museums physically and mentally to handle emergencies that can harm vulnerable and irreplaceable collections. You will have a completed institutional disaster-preparedness and response plan at the end of the course. Logistics: Participants in Disaster Plan Research and Writing work at their own pace. Instructor Terri Schindel is available at scheduled times for email support. Opportunities for interaction include forums and scheduled online chats. Each section includes a written assignment that becomes support material for drafting an actual disaster preparedness plan. Materials include readings, lecture notes, links to relevant web sites and handouts. The course is limited to 20 participants. MS205/6: Disaster Plan Research and Writing lasts eight weeks. To reserve a spot in the course, please pay at http://www.collectioncare.org/tas/tas.html If you have trouble please contact Helen Alten at [log in to unmask] The Instructor: Terri Schindel, graduated from the Courtauld Art Institute, University of London with a concentration in textile conservation. Since 1988 she has taught collections care and preventive conservation to museum staff. She has assisted museums in writing disaster plans for more than a decade and helped develop national standards for disaster-preparedness materials. Ms. Schindel specializes in collection care and preventive conservation and works regularly with small, rural and tribal museums. She is familiar with the many challenges and lack of resources facing these institutions. Ms. Schindel is committed to maintaining the uniqueness of each museum while ensuring that they serve as a resource for future generations. -- Brad Bredehoft Sales and Technology Manager Northern States Conservation Center www.collectioncare.org www.museumclasses.org ========================================================Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 13:32:43 -0600 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Catherine Bayles <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundaryô6d04462e7a827ef404d64123c0 Message-ID: [log in to unmask]> --f46d04462e7a827ef404d64123c0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Linda, I agree that programs should disclose full details about how many of their students receive full time employment inside or outside of the field. Along the same lines, potential applicants to graduate program should make sure to *ask questions* along these lines! As a second year graduate student, I can say that when looking at schools, my program's almost 100% job placement rate within one year was a major reason that I decided to attend. Best, Cate Catherine Bayles 2013 Masters Candidate, Museum Studies Cooperstown Graduate Program [log in to unmask] | www.freshinthefield.wordpress.com ========================================================Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). --f46d04462e7a827ef404d64123c0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Linda,

I agree that programs should disclose full details about how many of their students receive full time employment inside or outside of the field. Along the same lines, potential applicants to graduate program should make sure to ask questions along these lines! As a second year graduate student, I can say that when looking at schools, my program's almost 100% job placement rate within one year was a major reason that I decided to attend.

Best,
Cate

Catherine Bayles
2013 Masters Candidate, Museum Studies
Cooperstown Graduate Program
[log in to unmask] | www.freshinthefield.wordpress.com

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--f46d04462e7a827ef404d64123c0-- ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 13:40:48 -0600 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Rachel Smith <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> Matthew, Do you suggest a way that applicants can address the issue of "wired" job announcements without causing offense? Rachel Smith [log in to unmask] On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 1:13 PM, Matthew White <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > Having been on both sides of this issue I can see, oddly enough, both sides. > As a general rule, I think it is the applicant's decision which burden's to > bear to be interviewed or take a job whether it involves relocation, buying > a new wardrobe, or some other task or expense not directly related to the > job. It is also perfectly legitimate to ask that applicant during the > interview how they plan to do it and not be satisfied with the answer. > (assuming the topic does not fall into an area explicitly forbidden to ask > about). > > One the other hand I can see why an institution might want limit potential > applicants to people they think can realistically take the job with minimal > burden and within a reasonable time frame. (Relocation takes a lot more time > for a person to start) Hiring a position is a lot of work, and no one wants > to do it more than they have to. An institution wants to make sure they > don't have to go through the whole thing in a month because the successful > candidate couldn't afford the move after all or do it a year later because > he or she didn't like the country (or the city) after all and/or got > homesick. Advertising only locally is a fine way to maximize quality > applicants. (Quality defined here as someone in a solid position to start > the job quickly, and ensure some longevity) But the way position > announcements travel the internet, I am not sure that is the best solution. > More and more I have noticed announcements put in phrases like "preference > shown to local applicants" or "preference shown to applicants who can start > by X date." I think that is perfectly legitimate. After that it is up to the > applicant to cross those bears. > > Regardless, I think the best is for everyone involved to be as honest as > possible about salaries, relocation reimbursement, interview travel > reimbursement, etc. Someone else mentioned a little white lie when saying > you planned to relocate. Fine, I see that and there are a lot of shadings in > any social interaction. But if that blows up later, there will be trouble > and proof of lying during the application process is one of the few > absolute, no questions asked fireable offenses. Play that game very > carefully. (Say I am under the impression you were relocating to my town > whether you got my job or not and you tell me when, because I will certainly > ask what your plans are in that regard. If you don't start when you say you > can start and I find out you lied about your plans and intent, there is > going to be trouble.) > > And on a side note. If a hiring institution promises to reimburse for travel > expenses for an interview, it is unprofessional and morally wrong to renege > on that. I am still owed money by an institution that promised to reimburse > for meals and local transportation when I flew across the country for an > interview and I have found this is not as rare as we would hope. > > And while I am getting things out there, while I can agree there are many > shadings and strategies on this topic in the hiring process, there is one > habit which I cannot abide and I think if there is pure evil in this regard, > this is it. That is putting applicants through the interview process when > you know they have no hope of ever getting the job. We all know the "wired" > job announcements exist. These are jobs that are officially open, but the > position is already going to a specific person and the announcement is > merely a formality. This is done for a variety of reasons and I understand > it is part of the game. I don't like it, but I understand it. Hate the game, > not the player etc etc. But to put an applicant through the interview > process, including costly investments in wardrobe, travel, time off from > existing jobs, and other expenses when they have little if any chance of > getting the job is just wrong and it happens all the time. I feel very > strongly about this. I have been interviewed for no less than 6 jobs (that I > know of) that I later found out I had no chance at because they were already > promised to someone else. > > So though I agree the burden should be on the applicant, if an institution > really only wants local applicants, whether to keep the resumes to a > minimum, maximize retention, or to speed the hiring process, fine. But don't > string someone along if you don't think you will hire them. It's easy to do > because job searchers as a group are probably poorer, more desperate, and > eager for any opportunity. But just don't. > > Sorry that turned in to a rant there, but this really makes me angry and the > young professionals out there need to know what's out there. > > Matthew White > > > > I can appreciate what you're saying, Jamie. But honestly, I wonder if it > isn't more of a financial hardship on these grads to not have jobs than to > spend a few hundred bucks on an interview. I mean, I wouldn't do it for the > first interview. But at the second interview level (first via phone), they > have a better sense of their chances and it could be a justifiable expense. > Especially if they live in cities that are crowded with museum studies > graduates--there might not be 10 but rather hundreds of local applicants for > every job. But they also wouldn't want to just move to a new place without a > job offer in hand just to become a local--especially to cities with fewer > opportunities or high living expenses. They're caught between a rock and a > hard place. > Cheers, > Shana > > > On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:52 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]> > wrote: >> >> From the Museum perspective, I think a small to medium museum is not going >> to consider an out-of-State candidate if they are located more than a >> reasonable day trip away from the museum they apply to because the museum >> does not have the resources to reimburse each candidate for travel and they >> do realize that these candidates are just starting out and do not have the >> means to fly in for an interview for an entry level job either. That is why >> we keep our search State wide for entry level positions. Please keep in mind >> that we typically receive at least 50 resumes for such positions, all of >> which have basically the same level of education and experience and at least >> 10 of these candidates are fairly local, so there is no shortage of >> qualified local candidates. If we did advertise nationwide for such >> positions, I would really have a hard time as a human being asking a >> candidate to fly in knowing, at this stage in their career, it would cause >> them financial hardship when they are competing against so many other >> candidates with basically the same credentials. I would really concentrate >> my search locally, try and attain an entry level position and then take it >> from there. Certainly when you are ready to move on to a higher position, >> the search parameters widen and you can cast your net wider as well. >> >> >> >> Jamie >> >> >> >> From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On >> Behalf Of Shana West >> Sent: Thursday, February 21, 2013 9:27 AM >> To: [log in to unmask] >> Subject: SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the >> recent graduates >> >> >> >> I have found it puzzling when museums I applied to in other states weren't >> interested because I wasn't local. I moved across the country for my first, >> entry-level museum job. Many graduates would jump at the chance for a full >> time job, regardless of location. So when grads have come to me asking for >> advice on applying out of state, I've told them to say they're already >> planning on moving to that city independently of the job (yes, it's a white >> lie). That way, the hiring museum won't feel like they have to pay expenses. >> >> >> >> I haven't tried it myself, but I was in a situation where I was actually >> moving to a new city and applying for a job. I don't think I would have been >> considered had I not already been planning a move. In fact, I'm pretty sure >> they asked me on the phone interview, "And you're definitely moving here?" >> >> >> >> Just an idea. >> >> Shana >> >> >> >> On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:08 AM, Jamie Smith <[log in to unmask]> >> wrote: >> >> Hi All: >> >> I have posted positions on local sites before, such as MANY (Museum >> Association of the State of NY) and I have interviewed and hired candidates >> from these postings. Perhaps you need to look at State museum organizations >> rather than national organizations to post your resume on. I know from the >> Museum perspective, we are not interested in a nationwide search to fill an >> entry level position, so we keep the posting local, or at least at the State >> level. >> >> >> >> Hope this helps and good luck, >> >> Jamie Smith Quinn >> >> Executive Director >> >> FASNY Museum of Firefighting >> >> >> >> From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On >> Behalf Of Laurie A Sedicino >> Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 11:08 PM >> >> >> To: [log in to unmask] >> Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent >> graduates >> >> >> >> I would also be interested in the answer to Matthew’s question. I have to >> agree that - at least for museum field jobs – I have never once experienced >> museum search committees using posted resume sources…and I have never been >> contacted through these sources. I would like to hear along with Matthew if >> you think these are good uses of such spare job search time and energy?? >> >> >> >> Thanks >> >> Laurie >> >> >> >> ________________________________ >> >> From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On >> Behalf Of Matthew White >> Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 4:52 PM >> To: [log in to unmask] >> Subject: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent >> graduates >> >> >> >> I have a question for the group that is tangentially related. >> >> >> >> There are several professional organizations that invite those looking for >> a job to post their resumes and particulars. (I have posted at both AAM and >> AASLH. I am sure there are similar sites in other niches of the field.) I >> have also posted on Linked-In. As anyone who has ever done this knows, it >> can be kind of time consuming to enter and keep current. >> >> >> >> Has anyone ever gotten contact through one of these services? An >> interview? A job? >> >> >> >> For those of you who have hired recently, did you use these services? If >> not why not? >> >> >> >> What about Linked-In? >> >> >> >> Personally, I know a lot of people in the job market and even a good >> number who hire and I have never heard of ANYONE even being contacted >> through one of these services, let alone get a job. >> >> >> >> Does anyone think these are good uses of spare job search time and energy? >> >> >> >> Matthew White >> >> On Feb 20, 2013, at 4:34 PM, Ashley Watson <[log in to unmask]> wrote: >> >> >> >> Hello all, >> >> I want to thank you all for sharing your experiences and the advice. I >> already decided to open my search wide open to start somewhere. I had two >> job interviews that took the place last November but didn't get the job. I >> received a PERSONAL email from a museum to inform me that my professional >> package has been forwarded directly to the museum director. So it certainly >> passed the human resources wall. So with that, should I check with them for >> the status progression? >> >> >> >> One more thing: >> >> In response to Allison Bott, despite my name giving an implication that I >> would be a female, I am actually a male. That is alright. I will read the >> article in the link you provided as it may apply to me as I am also in the >> minority as i am Deaf. So I face the same challenges as others who are in >> the minorities. >> >> >> >> Ashley Watson >> >> >> >> On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 4:24 PM, Jillian Shoblock <[log in to unmask]> >> wrote: >> >> I have been applying since December 2011 when I graduated with my MA in >> Museum Studies an have only had 2 interviews. Do I get frustrated a lot, yes >> but I haven't given up hope yet. I do still have an active social life and >> work in management in retail. Is that what I want? Definitely not. I intern >> at a museum that I love and would love to be able to work at. But can't >> afford to hire me so right now I am getting a little of what I love to do. >> What I have found is trying to stay positive even though I have applied to >> well over 100 positions all dealing with collections management and most >> with history, since that is one of my undergraduate degrees, is what keeps >> me going. Try to enjoy your life outside the museum an continue to visit >> museums. If you can't find a job in I e and have to work elsewhere then >> volunteer so you still get your fill. I know it sucks, trust me all my >> friends have full time jobs and are "living the life" but I have to believe >> that my time will come. Also my one friend keeps telling me to look at >> higher Ed jobs like academic advising if you have a masters. Just a thought. >> Good luck and keep your head up! >> >> Jillian >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> >> On Feb 20, 2013, at 3:58 PM, "Jentzsch, Tracy" <[log in to unmask]> >> wrote: >> >> > Ashley, for you and others searching for job leads, I would recommend a >> > free resource we offer through the University of Delaware's Museum >> > Studies >> > Program. MuseWeekly is our weekly electronic news that provides job >> > posts, internships, conferences, calls for papers, announcements and >> > news >> > related to all things "museum". We never rent or sell our list, and >> > there >> > is always a plethora of good leads. You can sign up for this free >> > resource by going to our website, www.udel.edu/museumstudies and filing >> > in >> > the three question form on the index page. Good luck to you. >> > >> > >> > >> > Tracy H. Jentzsch >> > Staff Assistant, Museum Studies Program >> > University of Delaware >> > 302.831.1251 >> > Www.udel.edu/museumstudies >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > On 2/20/13 3:49 PM, "Ashley Watson" <[log in to unmask]> wrote: >> > >> >> Hello, >> >> I graduated with masters in the museum studies at Syracuse University >> >> last May and have not found a job yet despite aggressively applying for >> >> various openings within my experience and skill range. I have completed >> >> an internship at National Museum of Natural History in the exhibits >> >> department and is currently a zooarchaeological/collections intern at >> >> the >> >> Museum Support Center till this May. Any recent graduates here that >> >> have the same frustrating experience? Those internships certainly >> >> help >> >> keep me sane professionally and personally but I certainly need to >> >> begin >> >> LIVING. I want to add one thing that I was more than qualified for one >> >> position at National Museum of Natural History but didn't break through >> >> the annoying human resources "wall". My colleague who was qualified to >> >> the maximum also applied for the same position got the same result. >> >> >> >> ========================================================= >> >> Important Subscriber Information: >> >> >> >> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at >> >> http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed >> >> information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail >> >> message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message >> >> should >> >> read "help" (without the quotes). >> >> >> >> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message >> >> to >> >> [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read >> >> "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). >> > >> > ========================================================= >> > Important Subscriber Information: >> > >> >> > The Museum-L FAQ file is located at >> > http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed >> > information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message >> > to [log in to unmask] .. The body of the message should read >> > "help" (without the quotes). >> >> >> > >> > If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message >> > to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read >> > "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). >> >> ========================================================= >> Important Subscriber Information: >> >> The Museum-L FAQ file is located at >> http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed >> information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message >> to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" >> (without the quotes). >> >> If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to >> [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff >> Museum-L" (without the quotes). >> >> >> >> >> >> ________________________________ >> >> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 >> >> >> >> >> >> ________________________________ >> >> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 >> >> >> >> ________________________________ >> >> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 >> >> >> >> ________________________________ >> >> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 >> >> >> >> >> >> ________________________________ >> >> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 >> >> >> ________________________________ >> >> To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: >> http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 > > > > ________________________________ > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 > > > > ________________________________ > > To unsubscribe from the MUSEUM-L list, click the following link: > http://home.ease.lsoft.com/scripts/wa-HOME.exe?SUBED1=MUSEUM-L&A=1 ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 14:49:04 -0500 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Deb Fuller <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 2:40 PM, Rachel Smith <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > Do you suggest a way that applicants can address the issue of "wired" > job announcements without causing offense? In the Fed world and I assume in State and local government, anything that is advertised for less than a month is usually wired. Jobs have to be advertised if the position classification, pay grade, or duties significantly change. Also if the person is going from temp to perm, the job is usually advertised for a couple of weeks. I've also gotten to the selection committee and then have the job mysteriously disappear, probably because the person for whom it was selected didn't make the cut and they needed to readvertise the job again for that person. You can always use your network and covertly ask around to see if that job is wired or not. Even an innocent, "Hey, I'm interested in X job. Can someone tell me something about it?" might get you an honest response from an insider who will tell you if it is wired (off the record). I've been severely tempted to just ask flat out in interviews, "So, is this job wired? If so, I'll just save you all the time. Mark me down as interviewed and we'll go on our merry ways." I haven't yet but some day, I just might. :) Deb Fuller ========================================================Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 15:05:28 -0500 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Courtney Titus <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Paid Collections Move Internship Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> The Park City Museum in Park City, Utah has an immediate opening for two Collections Move Interns. The successful candidates will assist with a collections move to an off-site storage facility. The interns will become well-versed in basic inventory procedures, re-housing and packing methods and materials, collections moves and database data entry. Job Description: The Collections Move Interns’ central task will be to move 2,700 objects from collections storage to a new off-site storage facility by the end of August. The Collections Move Interns will create move reports, verify object numbers and locations, re-house and pack objects, physically move objects to a new location, unpack objects and update locations in PastPerfect. Additional duties will include staffing the front desk, operating a cash register, answering visitors’ questions, researching and writing one to two articles for the local paper, cataloging, helping install/de-install exhibits and other administrative tasks as needed. About our organization: The Park City Museum reopened after an $8.9 million renovation and expansion in October 2009 and serves a variety of visitors, including the local community and tourists. The collection is remarkably diverse in type and size, and museum programs include school and youth groups, tours, lectures and classes, family activities, and special events. Desired Qualifications: • Graduate degree, or working towards a degree, preferably in History, Museum Studies or related field. Undergraduate candidates will be considered if no graduate candidates are identified. • Knowledge and experience with correct artifact handling techniques and re-housing/packing methods. • Experience with database software (experience with PastPerfect a plus); standard office computer skills are required. • Self-motivated with strong organizational, teamwork and interpersonal skills. • Excellent written communication skills and legible handwriting. • Must be detail-oriented and able to work independently. • Ability to climb ladders and lift up to 40 lbs. • Driver’s License and access to a vehicle would be preferable. • Knowledge and understanding of museum management and procedures. • Experience working on previous collections move projects a plus. Schedule/Stipend: Preferred start date of May 1 (negotiable). This is a four-month internship with a ~$5,000 stipend per person. Hours will vary and include some evenings until 7:30 pm and some Saturdays. Stipend does not include housing, but Museum staff may be able to help to find local housing. Please send a letter of interest and resume by Monday, March 11, 2013 to: Courtney Titus, Curator of Collections and Exhibits, [log in to unmask] (with "INTERNSHIP" in the subject). ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 12:06:21 -0800 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: "Glenn A. Walsh" <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Preservation? Buhl Planetarium & Schenley High School Comments: To: ASTC Listserver <[log in to unmask]>, Dome-L <[log in to unmask]>, History of Astronomy Discussion Group <[log in to unmask]>, Public Observatory Mailing List <[log in to unmask]>, All_Astronomers_Ar[log in to unmask], [log in to unmask], Astronomy Club of India <[log in to unmask]>, Astronomy Online <[log in to unmask]>, [log in to unmask], [log in to unmask], [log in to unmask], [log in to unmask] Comments: cc: Glenn Walsh <[log in to unmask]> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> Last week, the weekly Pittsburgh City Paper published a news article on the efforts of graduates of Pittsburgh's Schenley High School to stop the Pittsburgh Public Schools from selling the historic building, so that the building can be converted into 178 luxury apartments. The Schenley alumni believe that the building is still usable as, and should remain as, a school. In this week's issue of the Pittsburgh City Paper, Friends of the Zeiss Project Director Glenn A. Walsh responds with a Letter-to-the-Editor published in the "Incoming" column on page 6, comparing these efforts of the Schenley High School alumni with similar efforts, more than a decade ago, of former employees and volunteers of Pittsburgh's original Buhl Planetarium and Institute of Popular Science to maintain the educational capabilities of historic Buhl Planetarium equipment and artifacts in the historic Buhl Planetarium building, currently used for educational purposes by the Children's Museum of Pittsburgh. http://spacewatchtower.blogspot.com/2013/02/preservation-buhl-planetarium-schenley.html gaw Glenn A. Walsh, Project Director, Friends of the Zeiss < http://friendsofthezeiss.org > Electronic Mail - < [log in to unmask] > SpaceWatchtower Blog: < http://spacewatchtower.blogspot.com/ > ========================================================Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 15:23:49 -0500 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Jennifer Vess <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Summer Internships MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01CE1071.2AB0A5A1" Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01CE1071.2AB0A5A1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Jewish Museum of Maryland 2013 Summer Internships Interning with the Jewish Museum of Maryland (JMM) is a dynamic, interesting, educational, and fun experience. JMM summer internships are full time for ten weeks and include a modest stipend. All summer interns at the JMM participate in professional development workshops, attend field trips, and contribute to the museum's blog. Free parking is provided. Housing is not provided. Orientation for the summer internship program will be held on Monday June 3, 2012. Requirements and application deadlines vary by department. JMM ARCHIVES INTERN The Jewish Museum of Maryland seeks a qualified intern to assist in the museum archives. The Archives Intern will be responsible for cataloging archival documents, processing manuscript collections, and assisting with the triennial archives inventory. Processing collections involves organizing archival collections and writing documents that help researchers locate materials within the collection. Duties may also include digitizing parts of archival collections as well as research. Interested students should be working toward a degree in history, art history, material culture, Jewish studies, museum studies, or library science. Previous museum or library experience is not required. This internship is full time for ten weeks and includes a modest stipend. Please send a cover letter, resume, availability and list of three references to Ms. Jennifer Vess, Archivist, Jewish Museum of Maryland, 15 Lloyd Street, Baltimore MD 21202 or to [log in to unmask] Please include "JMM Archives Intern" in your subject line. Applications are due by Friday, March 15, 2013. COLLECTIONS INTERN The Jewish Museum of Maryland seeks a qualified intern to assist in the Collections Department to work on general collections management projects. Tasks include, but are not limited to: cataloging new donations and loans, collections inventory, object photography, data entry, digitizing photographic collections, artifact handling, and indexing and/or transcribing oral histories. Interested students should be working toward a degree in museum studies, archival science, history, art history, material culture, or Jewish studies. Previous museum experience not required. Attention to detail required. This internship is full time for ten weeks and includes a modest stipend. Please send a cover letter, resume, availability and list of three references (two of which must be professional or academic) to Ms. Jobi Zink, Sr. Collections Manager, Jewish Museum of Maryland, 15 Lloyd Street, Baltimore MD 21202 or to [log in to unmask] Please include "Collections Intern" in your subject line. Application deadline is Friday March 15, 2013. EDUCATION AND PROGRAM INTERN Responsibilities include: leading tours for school and adult groups (training to be provided); developing special programs for schools and teacher training workshops; assisting with preparation for public and family programs; and providing marketing assistance. Time expectation: 30 hours per week College undergrad or grad preferred. Please send resume, cover letter and availability to the following: Ilene Dackman-Alon, Director of Education The Jewish Museum of Maryland 15 Lloyd Street Baltimore, MD 21202 410.732.6400 X214 [log in to unmask] EXHIITION RESEARCH INTERN The Jewish Museum of Maryland seeks a qualified intern to assist in research for upcoming Jews, Health, and Healing exhibition, projected to open at the JMM in spring 2015. Tasks include, but are not limited to: research in JMM archival holdings, oral history transcription, assisting in collection of materials from community members. Interested students should be working toward a degree in history, medical history, museum studies, or curatorial studies. Experience and/or interest in conducting oral histories a plus, but previous museum or gallery experience is not required. Internship will run 10 weeks and includes a modest stipend. This internship can be used for academic credit. Please send a cover letter, dates of availability, resume, and list of three references to Karen Falk Curator, Jewish Museum of Maryland, 15 Lloyd Street, Baltimore MD 21202 or to [log in to unmask] Please include "Exhibition Intern" in your subject line. Applications reviewed as received. PHOTO ARCHIVE INTERN The Jewish Museum of Maryland seeks qualified candidates for an interdisciplinary internship. Photo archive interns will be responsible for processing, cataloging and digitizing the JMM photograph collection as well as assisting with image research for a variety of publications and exhibitions. Interested students should be working toward a degree in history, art history, material culture, Jewish studies, museum studies, library science, or photography. Previous museum or library experience is not required. This internship is full time for ten weeks and includes a modest stipend. Please send a cover letter, resume, availability and list of three references to Ms. Jennifer Vess, Archivist, Jewish Museum of Maryland, 15 Lloyd Street, Baltimore MD 21202 or to [log in to unmask] Please include "JMM Photo Intern" in your subject line. Applications are due by Friday, March 15, 2013. URBAN ARCHAEOLOGY INTERN The Jewish Museum of Maryland seeks a qualified intern to assist in the Collections Department to work on the Lloyd Street Synagogue and urban archaeology collection. Tasks include, but are not limited to: artifact handling, cataloguing archaeology specimens, reconciling object numbers, assisting in LSS collections inventory, object photography, and data entry. Interested students should be working toward a degree in museum studies, archaeology, history, art history, material culture, or Jewish studies. Attention to detail required. Experience with numbering systems is preferred. Experience with object photography preferred. This internship is full time for ten weeks and includes a modest stipend. Please send a cover letter, resume, availability and list of three references (two of which must be professional or academic) to Ms. Jobi Zink, Sr. Collections Manager, Jewish Museum of Maryland, 15 Lloyd Street, Baltimore MD 21202 or to [log in to unmask] Please include "LSS Archaeology Intern" in your subject line. Application deadline is Friday March 15, 2013. Jobi O. Zink Sr. Collections Manager Jewish Museum of Maryland 15 Lloyd Street Baltimore, MD 21202 (410) 732-6400 ext. 226 [log in to unmask] Archivist, Curatorial Assistant Jewish Museum of Maryland 15 Lloyd Street Baltimore, MD 21202 410-732-6400 x213 [log in to unmask] ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ------_=_NextPart_001_01CE1071.2AB0A5A1 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Jewish Museum of Maryland 2013 Summer Internships

 

Interning with the Jewish Museum of Maryland (JMM) is a dynamic, interesting, educational, and fun experience. JMM summer internships are full time for ten weeks and include a modest stipend. All summer interns at the JMM participate in professional development workshops, attend field trips, and contribute to the museum’s blog.  Free parking is provided. Housing is not provided. Orientation for the summer internship program will be held on Monday June 3, 2012. Requirements and application deadlines vary by department.

 

JMM ARCHIVES INTERN

 

The Jewish Museum of Maryland seeks a qualified intern to assist in the museum archives. The Archives Intern will be responsible for cataloging archival documents, processing manuscript collections, and assisting with the triennial archives inventory.  Processing collections involves organizing archival collections and writing documents that help researchers locate materials within the collection.  Duties may also include digitizing parts of archival collections as well as research.

 

Interested students should be working toward a degree in history, art history, material culture, Jewish studies, museum studies, or library science. Previous museum or library experience is not required. This internship is full time for ten weeks and includes a modest stipend.

 

Please send a cover letter, resume, availability and list of three references to Ms. Jennifer Vess, Archivist, Jewish Museum of Maryland, 15 Lloyd Street, Baltimore MD 21202 or to [log in to unmask]. Please include “JMM Archives Intern” in your subject line. Applications are due by Friday, March 15, 2013.

 

COLLECTIONS INTERN

The Jewish Museum of Maryland seeks a qualified intern to assist in the Collections Department to work on general collections management projects. Tasks include, but are not limited to: cataloging new donations and loans, collections inventory, object photography, data entry, digitizing photographic collections, artifact handling, and indexing and/or transcribing oral histories.

 

Interested students should be working toward a degree in museum studies, archival science, history, art history, material culture, or Jewish studies. Previous museum experience not required. Attention to detail required. This internship is full time for ten weeks and includes a modest stipend.

 

 

Please send a cover letter, resume, availability and list of three references (two of which must be professional or academic) to Ms. Jobi Zink, Sr. Collections Manager, Jewish Museum of Maryland, 15 Lloyd Street, Baltimore MD 21202 or to [log in to unmask]. Please include “Collections Intern” in your subject line. Application deadline is Friday March 15, 2013.

EDUCATION AND PROGRAM INTERN

 

Responsibilities include: leading tours for school and adult groups (training to be provided); developing special programs for schools and teacher training workshops; assisting with preparation for public and family programs; and providing marketing assistance.

 

Time expectation: 30 hours per week

 

College undergrad or grad preferred.

 

Please send resume, cover letter and availability to the following:

Ilene Dackman-Alon, Director of Education
The Jewish Museum of Maryland
15 Lloyd Street
Baltimore, MD 21202
410.732.6400 X214
[log in to unmask]

EXHIITION RESEARCH INTERN

 

The Jewish Museum of Maryland seeks a qualified intern to assist in research for upcoming Jews, Health, and Healing exhibition, projected to open at the JMM in spring 2015. Tasks include, but are not limited to: research in JMM archival holdings, oral history transcription, assisting in collection of materials from community members.

 

Interested students should be working toward a degree in history, medical history, museum studies, or curatorial studies. Experience and/or interest in conducting oral histories a plus, but previous museum or gallery experience is not required. Internship will run 10 weeks and includes a modest stipend. This internship can be used for academic credit.

 

Please send a cover letter, dates of availability, resume, and list of three references to Karen Falk Curator, Jewish Museum of Maryland, 15 Lloyd Street, Baltimore MD 21202 or to [log in to unmask]. Please include “Exhibition Intern” in your subject line. Applications reviewed as received.

 

 

PHOTO ARCHIVE INTERN

 

The Jewish Museum of Maryland seeks qualified candidates for an interdisciplinary internship. Photo archive interns will be responsible for processing, cataloging and digitizing the JMM photograph collection as well as assisting with image research for a variety of publications and exhibitions. 

   

Interested students should be working toward a degree in history, art history, material culture, Jewish studies, museum studies, library science, or photography. Previous museum or library experience is not required. This internship is full time for ten weeks and includes a modest stipend.

 

Please send a cover letter, resume, availability and list of three references to Ms. Jennifer Vess, Archivist, Jewish Museum of Maryland, 15 Lloyd Street, Baltimore MD 21202 or to [log in to unmask]. Please include “JMM Photo Intern” in your subject line. Applications are due by Friday, March 15, 2013.

 

URBAN ARCHAEOLOGY INTERN

The Jewish Museum of Maryland seeks a qualified intern to assist in the Collections Department to work on the Lloyd Street Synagogue and urban archaeology collection. Tasks include, but are not limited to: artifact handling, cataloguing archaeology specimens, reconciling object numbers, assisting in LSS collections inventory, object photography, and data entry.

 

Interested students should be working toward a degree in museum studies, archaeology, history, art history, material culture, or Jewish studies. Attention to detail required. Experience with numbering systems is preferred. Experience with object photography preferred. This internship is full time for ten weeks and includes a modest stipend.

 

Please send a cover letter, resume, availability and list of three references (two of which must be professional or academic) to Ms. Jobi Zink, Sr. Collections Manager, Jewish Museum of Maryland, 15 Lloyd Street, Baltimore MD 21202 or to [log in to unmask]. Please include “LSS Archaeology Intern” in your subject line. Application deadline is Friday March 15, 2013.

 

 

 

 

 

Jobi O. Zink

Sr. Collections Manager

Jewish Museum of Maryland

15 Lloyd Street

Baltimore, MD  21202

(410) 732-6400 ext. 226

[log in to unmask]

 

 

Archivist, Curatorial Assistant

Jewish Museum of Maryland

15 Lloyd Street

Baltimore, MD 21202

410-732-6400 x213

[log in to unmask]

 

 

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------_=_NextPart_001_01CE1071.2AB0A5A1-- ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 14:57:15 -0500 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Matthew White <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: SPAM-MED: Re: [MUSEUM-L] Employment Search Frustrations for the recent graduates In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]> Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 MIME-version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 6.2 \(1499\)) Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> What Deb said. Also, job descriptions that are ridiculously specific and unique tend to be wired. I am at the point in my career that if I am suspicious I just email someone I know at the institution (if there is such a person) and ask outright. Remember the scene/passage in Hunger Games where the Committee is ignoring Katniss' feasts of archery? I've had interviews like that. It's like they can't be bothered to notice you. I don't suggest shooting the apple out of the pig's mouth to get their attention, but I would bet they already know who is getting the job. Matthew On Feb 21, 2013, at 2:49 PM, Deb Fuller <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 2:40 PM, Rachel Smith <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > >> Do you suggest a way that applicants can address the issue of "wired" >> job announcements without causing offense? > > In the Fed world and I assume in State and local government, anything > that is advertised for less than a month is usually wired. Jobs have > to be advertised if the position classification, pay grade, or duties > significantly change. Also if the person is going from temp to perm, > the job is usually advertised for a couple of weeks. I've also gotten > to the selection committee and then have the job mysteriously > disappear, probably because the person for whom it was selected didn't > make the cut and they needed to readvertise the job again for that > person. > > You can always use your network and covertly ask around to see if that > job is wired or not. Even an innocent, "Hey, I'm interested in X job. > Can someone tell me something about it?" might get you an honest > response from an insider who will tell you if it is wired (off the > record). I've been severely tempted to just ask flat out in > interviews, "So, is this job wired? If so, I'll just save you all the > time. Mark me down as interviewed and we'll go on our merry ways." I > haven't yet but some day, I just might. :) > > Deb Fuller > > ========================================================= > Important Subscriber Information: > > The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). > > If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 15:36:11 -0500 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Whitney <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Smartphone membership cards Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> Has anyone used/created/seen this? I work at a museum that is currently looking into the idea of giving patrons the option to have their membership cards delivered to their smartphone. We are 100% in the pre-pre-pre planning stages. But, we are wondering what the best ways to do this may be. An app? I've heard of a few museums doing this via a bar code in an email, which the patron would then have to save and pull up every time they visited the museum--but this would not be ideal for us. We're hoping to basically make it look like our membership cards, but digital. Any thoughts? Your comments are appreciated! ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 16:21:51 -0500 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Deb Fuller <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: Smartphone membership cards In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 3:36 PM, Whitney <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > We're hoping to basically make it look like our membership cards, but digital. Any thoughts? Your comments are appreciated! I currently use an app called "Key Ring" which allows me to enter in all my membership cards on my smartphone. I can either scan in the card using a barcode scanner or type in the numbers by hand. It saves them all in the app with the number and a barcode. Some stores can read the barcode but most just ask for my phone number or will input the number by hand. One hotel chain didn't even give me a physical card, just the numbers because they've gone all digital. I could print out a paper copy if I wanted to. Any smartphone will be able to display a .jpg or other picture of a card so it shouldn't be that hard to do your cards that way. People could e-mail the card around and get in for free but if you check people in via computer then you can track how many times people are using the card and possibly catch abuses. Deb Fuller ========================================================Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 15:23:26 -0600 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: S Barbosa <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: Smartphone membership cards In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary¼aec55550406bbf4a04d642aff4 Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> --bcaec55550406bbf4a04d642aff4 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 I know the Art Institute of Chicago offers a membership card app. It might even be passbook compatible. Maybe someone from the AIC will comment on this thread, but if not I'm sure you could contact their membership department for more information. Hope that helps! On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 2:36 PM, Whitney <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > Has anyone used/created/seen this? > > I work at a museum that is currently looking into the idea of giving > patrons the option to have their membership cards delivered to their > smartphone. We are 100% in the pre-pre-pre planning stages. But, we are > wondering what the best ways to do this may be. An app? > > I've heard of a few museums doing this via a bar code in an email, which > the patron would then have to save and pull up every time they visited the > museum--but this would not be ideal for us. > > We're hoping to basically make it look like our membership cards, but > digital. Any thoughts? Your comments are appreciated! > > ========================================================> Important Subscriber Information: > > The Museum-L FAQ file is located at > http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed > information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail > message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should > read "help" (without the quotes). > > If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to > [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read > "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). > ========================================================Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). --bcaec55550406bbf4a04d642aff4 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I know the Art Institute of Chicago offers a membership card app. It might even be passbook compatible. Maybe someone from the AIC will comment on this thread, but if not I'm sure you could contact their membership department for more information.

Hope that helps!

On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 2:36 PM, Whitney <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

Has anyone used/created/seen this?

I work at a museum that is currently looking into the idea of giving patrons the option to have their membership cards delivered to their smartphone.  We are 100% in the pre-pre-pre planning stages.  But, we are wondering what the best ways to do this may be.  An app?

I've heard of a few museums doing this via a bar code in an email, which the patron would then have to save and pull up every time they visited the museum--but this would not be ideal for us.

We're hoping to basically make it look like our membership cards, but digital.  Any thoughts?  Your comments are appreciated!

=========================================================
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--bcaec55550406bbf4a04d642aff4-- ========================================================================Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2013 16:24:33 -0500 Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> From: Elaine Miller <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: Smartphone membership cards In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1283) Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-ID: <[log in to unmask]> Sounds like a fantastic idea. The new iPhone 5 comes with an icon marked "Passbook" and describes it as "Passbook is the simplest way to get all your passes in one place." Theoretically i guess you're suppose to have your boarding passes, retail coupons, loyalty cards etc in one place. I haven't played with it yet but should imagine this would be the ideal place to keep a museum membership. I love the idea, it sure would tidy up my wallet. Elaine On Feb 21, 2013, at 3:36 PM, Whitney wrote: > Has anyone used/created/seen this? > > I work at a museum that is currently looking into the idea of giving patrons the option to have their membership cards delivered to their smartphone. We are 100% in the pre-pre-pre planning stages. But, we are wondering what the best ways to do this may be. An app? > > I've heard of a few museums doing this via a bar code in an email, which the patron would then have to save and pull up every time they visited the museum--but this would not be ideal for us. > > We're hoping to basically make it look like our membership cards, but digital. Any thoughts? Your comments are appreciated! > > ========================================================= > Important Subscriber Information: > > The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). > > If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes).