no prob. ----- Original Message ----- From: "lorettalorance" <[log in to unmask]> To: <[log in to unmask]> Sent: Saturday, September 21, 2002 7:51 PM > Well, I guess we read different accounts of the story. I think this is to > the list as I think my account of the Giuliani vs Ofoli story was. The blib > about Giuliani's rise in popularity after 9/11 went to you personally > because it was not related to museum work. But, don't worry, I won't do it > again. > Loretta > ----- Original Message ----- > Sent: Saturday, September 21, 2002 5:02 PM > > > > Sender: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> > > From: James Schulte <[log in to unmask]> > > Subject: Re: 9/11 Censorship? Statue of falling woman censored > > To: [log in to unmask] > > Precedence: list > > > > some of your facts here are wrong, Guiliani did not view this before > > becoming reactionary, he based his opinions on Roman Catholics who visited > > it and saw it as repulsive. He reacted after Cardinal O' Conner condemn > the > > work. As for Guiliani, he became the best arts marketer w/o doing a thing > > but being a typical politician and feeding off the public. If (/11 had not > > occurred he would have faded into obscurity, because he was faltering big > > time. Loreetta please post to leist not to me personally thank you. > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "lorettalorance" <[log in to unmask]> > > To: <[log in to unmask]> > > Sent: Saturday, September 21, 2002 11:38 AM > > Subject: Re: 9/11 Censorship? Statue of falling woman censored > > > > > > > Let's see, this was a little while ago: Rudy Giuliani went to see > > Sensations > > > at the Brooklyn Museum. He saw a mixed media work, primarily a painting, > > by > > > Chris Ofoli of the Madonna or Virgin Mary. Ofoli used elephant dung as > > part > > > of the body of Mary. Elephant dung is sacred where Ofoli comes from. > > > Giuliani got upset and began a personal crusade against the Ofoli work > of > > > art. As mayor of NYC, of which Brooklyn is a part, he threatened to pull > > > city funding away from the museum unless it removed the Ofoli from the > > > exhibition. He did not demand the closing of Sensations, only the > removal > > of > > > the Ofoli. The media, especially the Post/Daily News papers which are > > > somewhat sensationalists, took up the cry. Others got into the story. > > Blah, > > > blah, blah. > > > > > > After this Giuliani initiated some sort of city government watch-dog > > office > > > for art. I don't know if it's still in existence. It must not be or that > > > Fischl probably would have gotten into Rockefeller Center. > > > > > > So, the problem was not the entire Sensations show, it was one work in > the > > > show, the Ofoli which I think is now in some museum and his career has > > > blossomed. The entire thing was started by a Roman Catholic mayor, who > > > justifies cheating on his wife (at least 2 mistresses while mayor), who > > was > > > offended. > > > > > > The mayor using the power of his office and the personal hypocrisy of > his > > > religion felt it his place to demand the removal on the work of art that > > > offended him. Bloomberg has not, as far as I know, made any comment on > the > > > Fischl. I haven't really seen anything on the Fischl in the NYC papers > > since > > > it was first mentioned, as "bad." I don't think the Times has even > covered > > > it, I could have missed it though. The only debate about whether or not > > the > > > sculpture should stay that I've encountered is on this list. Other > people > > in > > > NYC may be talking about it, but not the art historians I know. > > > > > > Perhaps you consider the man-who-was-mayor-on-a-personal-crusade, > > Giuliani, > > > and the offended general public the same thing. But, these are not at > all > > > the same stories. > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "James Schulte" <[log in to unmask]> > > > To: <[log in to unmask]> > > > Sent: Friday, September 20, 2002 6:15 PM > > > Subject: Re: 9/11 Censorship? Statue of falling woman censored > > > > > > > > > > Loretta i have to beg to differ with you on Sensations, this exhibit > was > > > > offensive which began the Cities efforts to have it shut down. If no > had > > > > objected to its content and value there would have been no controversy > . > > > So > > > > the situation is similar. As for Guiliani"s reputation, he became a > hero > > > due > > > > to his behavior durring this crisis, however his popularity was fading > > and > > > > continues to fade with his womanizing. > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "lorettalorance" <[log in to unmask]> > > > > To: <[log in to unmask]> > > > > Sent: Friday, September 20, 2002 2:17 PM > > > > Subject: Re: 9/11 Censorship? Statue of falling woman censored > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------- > > > Introducing NetZero Long Distance > > > Unlimited Long Distance only $29.95/ month! > > > Sign Up Today! www.netzerolongdistance.com > > > > > > ========================================================= > > > Important Subscriber Information: > > > > > > The Museum-L FAQ file is located at > > http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed > > information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail > message > > to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read > "help" > > (without the quotes). > > > > > > If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message > to > > [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read > "Signoff > > Museum-L" (without the quotes). > > > > > > > ========================================================= > > Important Subscriber Information: > > > > The Museum-L FAQ file is located at > http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed > information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message > to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" > (without the quotes). > > > > If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to > [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff > Museum-L" (without the quotes). > > > > ------------------------------------------- > Introducing NetZero Long Distance > Unlimited Long Distance only $29.95/ month! > Sign Up Today! www.netzerolongdistance.com > > ========================================================= > Important Subscriber Information: > > The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "help" (without the quotes). > > If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff Museum-L" (without the quotes). > ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . 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