Wow, this is a great discussion! Like Indigo, I'm sure I could argue for either side, but seeing as its late on Friday, my brain can only handle two thoughts on this: One: standing in line at the grocery about a week after the event, and seeing the cover of People or some other rag. The picture: plane flying into Tower Two, and the day is hazy, looking like a sunrise or sunset. Me getting really irritated thinking "idiots, manipulators! everyone knows it was a gorgeous day, blue skies... why did you pick THAT image (whether just a bad picture or altered color), what's the point?!" Two: the children and grandchildren of these men, standing in front of the monument asking: "gee, that's you Grandpa? But why does your skin look so dark?" (yep, I work in a children's museum). Robyne -- "Reserve your right to think, for even to think wrongly is better than not to think at all." - Hypatia -- Robyne Miles Director of Operations & Volunteers The Science Factory www.sciencefactory.org phone: 541-682-7882 fax: 541-484-9027 reply to: [log in to unmask] > From: Annette Adele Wilson <[log in to unmask]> > Reply-To: Museum discussion list <[log in to unmask]> > Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 10:34:58 -0500 > To: [log in to unmask] > Subject: Re: flag- raising > > Thank you, Oliver! The facile over-use of "PC" as a dismissive term has > always bothered me. Your summary of why/how it is problematic is right on > the money. While it did not originate with Limbaugh, the accusatory cry of > "PC" certainly has been used as an effective way to silence voices who > speak for inclusion and mindfulness of the effects of exclusion and > injustice. > > While I missed the very beginning of this thread, it does seem to me > absurd to slavishly copy a photograph in creating a public sculpture. > This is especially true if the sculpture is intended not as simply a > portrait of the three individuals in the photo, but will stand for a much > larger, and more diverse, group of people. > > And thank you, Gayle-Indigo for reminding us of the constructedness of > race and racial categories. How do we "know" that the people in the photo > are "white" or "caucasian"? For that matter how do we "know" they were > all born biological males? As long as assumptions based on appearances > continue to be both automatic and troublingly salient in our culture, we > should question just how our symbolic -and public- representations > reinforce them. > > This is not simply a question of artistic license, of how the artist uses > many sources -perhaps many photos- to fill one sculpture with historic > meaning and symbolic life. It is a larger question of how, once made and > installed and quasi-permanent setting, a sculptural portrayal can shape > the imagination and create (or not) possibilities for the future. > > As long as the category "firefighter" continues to be filled, in > day-to-day life as well as in the fixed and enduring moment of bronze, by > people whose "whiteness" and "maleness" is a key identifying feature, the > harder it will continue to be for children whose non-whiteness and > non-maleness is apparent to imagine themselves one day filling that role. > And the harder it will be for "white males" to imagine themselves working > side-by-side simply with people: persons of any gender and of any > "color." > > > > Annette A. Wilson > _________________________ _____________________ > The University of Michigan > College of Architecture and Urban Planning : Research Assistant > -Joint Programs- : Interdisciplinary Program > 3+ Master of Architecture and : in Feminist Practice > Doctoral Program in Architecture : 2125 Lane Hall > Environment and Behavior : 734/763-3589 > __________________________________________________________________________ > > On Tue, 15 Jan 2002, Oliver V Hirsch wrote: > >> This is an amazing, and often appalling, string. >> >> First -- who cares about replicating this image with precision? Did you >> want a bronze version of a photograph? Or do you think that perhaps what >> we have here is a s-y-m-b-o-l; a symbolic rendering of the heroic actions >> of those who lived and those who died, but all of whom we New Yorkers >> count as heroes. New York is a wonderfully diverse community, and, to >> its credit, its Fire Department has over the past decades come to reflect >> that diversity. Is this monument to be a bronze memento of a great >> photographic moment? Who needs it?! The point is to memorialize the New >> York Fire Department, and the spirit of brave selflessness that its >> members have demonstrated. >> >> Second, to use a glib sobriquet like "pc" to dismiss the impulse toward >> making this symbol universal, and then think that you have said something >> profound is absurd. This is a limbaughism used to set the stage to >> snatch back the hard-won advances of the just struggles of women and >> people of color over the past couple of decades -- the centuries old >> struggles of people historically at the bottom and the back. Your >> intended dismissal is intellectually lazy, irresponsible, and that's the >> kind interpretation. >> >> We don't need another statue of white men representing all of humanity -- >> or all of the New York Fire Department for that matter. If this >> particular image meets more of this kind of backward opposition, no >> problem: we have many, many images of heroes in action, and we should >> pick a representative one. >> >> Oliver Hirsch >> Hirsch & Associates Fine Art Services, Inc. >> New York > > ========================================================= > Important Subscriber Information: > > The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ > . You may obtain detailed information about the listserv commands by sending a > one line e-mail message to [log in to unmask] . The body of the > message should read "help" (without the quotes). > > If you decide to leave Museum-L, please send a one line e-mail message to > [log in to unmask] . The body of the message should read "Signoff > Museum-L" (without the quotes). ========================================================= Important Subscriber Information: The Museum-L FAQ file is located at http://www.finalchapter.com/museum-l-faq/ . 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