--- Anne Sawicki <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> So...with regards to the comments put forth by indigonights and Deb Fuller
> regarding entry-level work...what you seem to be saying is that new people
> entering the museum profession right now have about a snowflake's chance in
> hell of finding work that will actually pay them a living wage.

Yep. Sad truth. I wish people would really take it to heart when applying for
all those student loans to get master's degrees in museum studies. And like
Indy mentioned, I also support capping masters programs so that there are a ton
of fresh grads out in the field looking for work. Other fields have done this
so I think its time for the museum field to do the same.

And while I think it's nice to have the luxury of concentrating in a specific
field, you really need to have back-up plans and a broad enough education that
you can work in another field. No one wants to go through the time, money, and
coursework for a masters degree in a field where they aren't likely to get a
job right off and find themselves barely qualified to be a secretary outside of
their field - not to mention the annoyance of having to explain to potential
employers why you have a masters degree and are applying for their admin
position. "Well I really wanted to be a curator of Pre-Celtic Chinese Art but
there's only 2 jobs in the world in that field and the people that are
currently in them aren't going to die off or get another job soon so I had to
look elsewhere for work."

> I also gather that hunting for entry-level museum work will be about as
painful as having a root canal done. Point taken, but it still saddens me to
think that such a wonderful profession has fallen on such hard times.

I think the museum profession has a lot more opportunities now than it did say
50 or even 30 years ago. Instead of just being collections of "stuff" curated
by doddy old men and women who have so much education that they are out of
touch with reality (no offense to the doddy old men and women on here ;),
museums now have positions for educators, computer professionals, exhibit
designers, publications managers, volunteer coordinators, development people,
etc. etc. You no longer have to have a PhD in some obscure subject to get in
the door. There are also a host of museum support professionals that do exhibit
design, education publications, visitor research, and management consulting
where aspiring museum professionals can get jobs. One only has to look at
institutions that still have their hand-typed exhibit lables from the mid-20th
century to know that "We've come a long way baby."

The downside of this is that 30+ years ago, there were few museums studies
programs and it wasn't really considered a career field. Most people stumbled
into the museum field. Now we've got scads of programs and career tracks which
created a glut of people who want to fill them.

> And I really take umbrage at the comment that as recent grads, we all "blew
> it" because we believed in our  dreams of becoming museum workers. Let me
> just say that none of us are fortunetellers and that there were a whole lot
of really smart economists out there who didn't see this negative trend coming
> either.

Hey, even with a good economy museum jobs would be hard to find. There are just
way more graduates than positions open and I don't see that changing even if
the economy recovers. Again, if you didn't have a back-up plan for a job, you
have no one to blame but yourself. It's like trying to be a professional piano
player and only playing Beethoven. Not many gigs out there for someone who only
plays Beethoven. But if you can read music and are willing to expand your
horizons, you'll have a good career and maybe find that all-Beethoven gig
you've always wanted.

> As grad students, we certainly couldn't predict that we would be trying to
> enter a job market during this massive downturn.

No. But you did enter a profession that was glutted to begin with. When I went
through my teacher training courses, I chose middle-school education because I
knew that field was expanding and would give me more options than doing grade
school or HS theater. (My undergrad degree is in theater.) Career centers have
loads of stats on how many jobs are out there, how many jobs are predicted to
be out there and how many people out there are looking for jobs. Anyone can do
that research and again, make their career plans accordingly.

>>We started our museum studies programs during good economic times. The
outlook for the profession was much more positive just a few years ago than it
is now. Sure, we believed our professors who told us that we would find work
when we got out of school.

Then quite frankly, your professors lied or didn't tell you the whole truth.
Again, while the museum profession might have grown during the 90s, it's never
been one of those fields where grads can easily find a job. Maybe someone who's
been around longer than me can correct me on this, but I've never seen a time
where museum positions have gone unfilled because there weren't people to fill
them. In the job boom of the mid-90s, I got rejection letters back saying that
there were over 100 applicants for a job at a little museum in podunk. At the
same time, I had friends in the computer industry getting fought over by
companies because there were more jobs than people to fill them.

If you want to always have a job, go into nursing or get a security clearance.
Those are about the only positions I know of that won't be glutted any time
soon.

> I'm telling you straight out that I think that this situation stinks. My
opinion doesn't count for much, but I think that this is a very bad trend.

Okay, so what are you going to do about it other than rant on this listserve?
Win the lottery and donate a lot of money to museums?

>It is eventually going to hurt the museum profession because the best and
brightest of the new grad students are now having to look for employment in
other fields. If they get better jobs, chances are they won't come back to
museums.

No. I don't think it will hurt the profession at all. If the schools keep
churning out grads the way they are doing, there will always been new grads to
fill positions. And once museum salaries start getting competitive with heck,
even teacher's salaries, people will come back into the profession. Most museum
people who get out would rather take a pay cut for a job they love if they can
afford to live on it. Bringing in corporate or other non-profit experience back
into the museum world will hopefully further improve it as well. This will in
turn, make it even harder for new grads to find jobs as you will be competing
with master's degrees and 10+ years of experience and not just the 3-5 years of
experience that's required now.

>  And now you want us to go back to school for much
> more expensive degrees but we still have little possibility of finding work?

Waaaaah! My heart bleeds but yes, if you want to curate, you'll pretty much
need a PhD in your subject area. People who want to teach at the college level
have to go through the same thing. It's a well-established standard in the
industry. It used to be that an MA would get you jobs but with the current glut
of new grads....

> If museums aren't hiring M.A.'s for even the
> lowest entry level jobs right now, then why would they even think of hiring
> brand new Phds? They'd have to pay them much more money, and money is the big

> problem for everyone right now.

Do your homework. PhD grads don't make much more, if not any more than MA grads
in the museum field. And they both have to have experience behind their degree
to really be competitive. Even with teacher's salaries, teachers with MAs or
PhDs make only a few thousand more than their fellow-teachers with the same
experience but less education. Little motivation to get those higher degrees
when you add up time and student loan costs. A much smarter route would be to
work at a company that gives tuition reembursement and get your degree while
you work. Job experience and your loans paid off. What a bargain!

Deb




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