The thread of conversation about the mice began when the query was posed
about alternatives to sticky glue traps for insects because sometimes mice
get caught in them unintentionally as well.  This is a valid concern for
some individuals, particularly on an ethical level, and as such it warrants
discussion, which is what this listserv is for.

Mr. Taylor's points about the snap traps not necessarily being useful or
humane are true and well-taken (evolutionary implications for the mice
aside), and are added to the knowledge bank along with thoughts on how to
remove mice should that be a problem and should that be a decision that an
individual or institution decides to make.  That is a decision for each
person to make separately, whether one agrees with it or not, but if one
does decide to do that it's useful to have knowledge of others' experience.

Thanks to everyone who has contributed to this thread of conversation -- it
has been useful, particularly in the sense of trying to find alternatives to
the sticky traps for insects (which drive me crazy).

><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><
Jenny Rebecca Martin, Collections Manager
The Morris Museum                      Phone: 973.971.3712
6 Normandy Heights Road                Fax: 973.538.0154
Morristown, NJ 07960                   Email [log in to unmask]


-----Original Message-----
From: Museum discussion list [mailto:[log in to unmask]]On
Behalf Of Adrienne DeAngelis
Sent: Wednesday, December 03, 2003 12:31 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: sticky traps


        Bravo Chris Taylor. Mice are awful. I hate mice. Stop talking
about ways to help them.
                Adrienne DeAngelis
                [log in to unmask]


On Tue, 2 Dec 2003, Chris Taylor wrote:

> Maybe it's just the Xmas. spirit talking but is this line of discussion
> for real?
> We are talking about mice here. I lost track, I think the original start
> was something about checking for insect with glue traps... and then
> moved into mice being stuck on glue traps? I had to reply after I read
> through the last 10+ messages all singing the praises of ways to remove
> mice from glue traps.
> If a mouse is in a glue trap baited or not that is a stupid mouse and we
> are doing the species a favor in eliminating it. I have used all the
> traps, whether in work places or places I have lived through the years
> and the live traps are only good for maybe two or three times (at least
> once I swear it was the same mouse caught a second time around too), the
> snap traps are not always so humane, I have seen mice escape a trap,
> even when I heard the trap go off and went to check right away, only to
> find a mouse a few days later, obviously killed by a broken back.
> The glue traps, are by far the best, most efficient and quick way to
> kill mice. I know some of you who wrote before are gasping now, but
> really, one mouse may be cute (especially if it is living outside where
> it belongs), a couple may be a slight annoyance, but if you have two
> then three and you don't stop their point of entry and start eliminating
> the mice already inside, you will have a multitude and that is not a
> pretty picture. I had a house have a break out of mice, and it was only
> a full scale assault via live traps first and then glue traps, along
> with finally finding a hole in the wall at ground level that was their
> entry, that finally eliminated the mice.
> As for live traps let me relate a true story- that house I mentioned
> above- had a few mice over the Thanksgiving weekend including one who
> was found helping itself to a plate of mac and cheese on the kitchen
> counter. Later that day we caught a very, very fat mouse in a live trap,
> I took it a block over to a park with a stream to release it. The mouse
> ran about 15 feet, then (I swear this is true) fell over and rolled into
> the creek. It was definitely a rodent holiday related heart attack.
> The alternative Melissa Duffes asked for below- if you want to eliminate
> mice inside- use the glue traps and hold the mayo.
>
> Not even a fan of Mickey
> Chris Taylor
> Atchison County Historical Society
> Atchison, Kansas - Kansas where the only good mouse is one living in a
field
>
>
>
> Melissa Duffes wrote:
>
> >Karen,
> >
> >I have been struggling with this problem as well. When I first came to my
> >house three months ago sticky traps were being used and staff were
placing
> >the traps (& live mice) in a plastic grocery bag for disposal. No, it is
not
> >a nice way to die. Mineral oil is supposed to loosen the mouse from the
> >glue, but this takes a very long time and can cause further harm if not
done
> >very gently (I have been most successful with mayonnaise, but it was
pointed
> >out to me that releasing a mayo-covered mouse into the wild was just
> >providing an extra-tasty snack for the local predators). I can't abandon
the
> >traps altogether as I still need to monitor insects, but the live cage
traps
> >I bought a few weeks ago can be very messy and hard to clean (not to
mention
> >the fact that a peanut butter-covered mouse in the woods is probably just
as
> >popular as a mayo-flavored one). I am thinking of resorting to those
> >electronic frequency things, but I'm not if they work at all.
> >
> >I'd also love to hear any alternatives from list members!
> >
> >
> >
> >Melissa Duffes
> >Assistant Coordinator
> >Historic Green Spring
> >4603 Green Spring Road
> >Alexandria, VA 22301
> >703-941-7987
> >[log in to unmask]
> >
> >
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Karen Duncan" <[log in to unmask]>
> >To: <[log in to unmask]>
> >Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2003 1:48 PM
> >Subject: Re: sticky traps
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >>As a card carrying member of the Bleeding Heart Tree Huggers, I have to
> >>ask: Is anyone else concerned about the potential cruelty of these
> >>sticky traps? Of course we must monitor our spaces for damaging pests,
> >>and OK, I can see them for insects, especially with close monitoring.
> >>But it concerns me on several different levels (practical; ethical,
> >>etc.) to think of mice stuck in them and dying slowly. Can't be a decent
> >>way to die. And carcasses attract insects! I'm not trying to begin a big
> >>ethical discussion but would like the list to know about any
> >>alternatives that people might be using. Anyone?
> >>
> >>Peace and love,
> >>
> >>Karen Duncan
> >>Registrar
> >>Frederick R. Weisman Art Museum
> >>University of Minnesota
> >>333 E. River Rd.
> >>Minneapolis, MN 55455
> >>T: 612.625.9665
> >>F: 612.625.9630
> >>E: [log in to unmask]
> >>
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